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Soviet Scientists Made This Two-Headed Dog | Motherboard

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Re: Soviet Scientists Made This Two-Headed Dog | Motherboard

#3

This is sick. The idea of two headed dog is not as sick in itself as is the clear misery these animals are experiencing.

Yes, it is absolutely horrendous. I was trying to imagine what it would be like to be aware of being a rider of a host body, separated from my body, unable to control my whereabouts.

Re: Soviet Scientists Made This Two-Headed Dog | Motherboard

#4
I'm not sure I can agree with the article's claim that these experiments were necessary:

"Without that terrifying two-headed dog, in other words, we’d all go down with our failing kidneys."

Eventually we would have found other ways to collect the data needed for safe organ transplants than using live mammals. It probably would have delayed the introduction of transplant procedures on humans, so in that sense there would have been "people going down with failing kidneys" -- but how much suffering can you justify by saying that it might save human lives down the road?

I'm reminded of Kazuo Ishiguro's excellent novel Never Let Me Go.

(--- Major spoiler alert! ---)

It takes place in a sort of parallel-universe Britain of the '70s and '80s where human cloning was invented just after WWII. Cloning has become the cure for cancer: just grow a steady supply of live clones, take their organs and transplant them to cancer-inflicted patients.... Of course it takes about 18 years to grow a clone, and you can't just keep these people in a vat somewhere. So the clones are people without citizen rights, whose sole mission in life is to be harvested eventually. Society sees this as justified because clones are not "real people" anyway -- and more importantly, nobody wants to turn the clock back to an era when people regularly died of cancer.

Re: Soviet Scientists Made This Two-Headed Dog | Motherboard

#5

This is sick. The idea of two headed dog is not as sick in itself as is the clear misery these animals are experiencing.

> But Demikhov’s work, while aesthetically disturbing and undoubtedly shocking (…) led to major gains in organ transplant research without compromising human health. His experiments, especially the organ transplants—he was the first to successfully complete both heart and lung transplants in animals — paved the way for the human version, leading to a procedure that has clearly saved countless lives over the ensuing decades.

Re: Soviet Scientists Made This Two-Headed Dog | Motherboard

#6

This is sick. The idea of two headed dog is not as sick in itself as is the clear misery these animals are experiencing.

Yes, it is absolutely horrendous. I was trying to imagine what it would be like to be aware of being a rider of a host body, separated from my body, unable to control my whereabouts.

Probably not that different from being paralyzed. I doubt dogs in such a situation would get very far into the more philosophical and abstract objections a human in that situation would probably experience.

Re: Soviet Scientists Made This Two-Headed Dog | Motherboard

#7
post #4

I'm not sure I can agree with the article's claim that these experiments were necessary: "Without that terrifying two-headed dog, in other words, we’d all go down with our failing kidneys." Eventually we would have found other ways to collect the data needed for safe organ transplants than using live mammals. It probably would have delayed the introduction of transplant procedures on humans, so in that sense there wo…

that's the plot for 'the island'

Re: Soviet Scientists Made This Two-Headed Dog | Motherboard

#8
post #4

I'm not sure I can agree with the article's claim that these experiments were necessary: "Without that terrifying two-headed dog, in other words, we’d all go down with our failing kidneys." Eventually we would have found other ways to collect the data needed for safe organ transplants than using live mammals. It probably would have delayed the introduction of transplant procedures on humans, so in that sense there wo…

Eventually we would have found other ways to collect the data needed for safe organ transplants than using live mammals.

To start doing the transplants you have to actually do the transplants. Insisting on avoiding doing it on mammals, wanting to do on humans gives only one solution: would you really prefer to immediately experiment on humans instead of mammals?

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