Torvalds clarifies Linux's Windows 8 Secure Boot position
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Re: Torvalds clarifies Linux's Windows 8 Secure Boot position
#2Re: Torvalds clarifies Linux's Windows 8 Secure Boot position
#3http://ftp.osuosl.org/pub/fosdem/2013/maintracks/K.1.105/UEF...
Re: Torvalds clarifies Linux's Windows 8 Secure Boot position
#4What was needed was for a trusted neutral party(or two) to be the owner of the root key, and for that organisation to hand out child keys (e.g. Microsoft, Open Source Initiative, Apple, etc) who could in turn generate child keys (all of which could be revoked). Essentially we need the "internet model" of key exchanges for this too.
I cannot understand who thought it was a good idea for Microsoft to be the only authorised party to generate keys. Even from Microsoft's perspective it is just asking to get anti-trust-ed again.
Re: Torvalds clarifies Linux's Windows 8 Secure Boot position
#5The thing about secure boot is that it is a GOOD idea done very badly indeed. What was needed was for a trusted neutral party(or two) to be the owner of the root key, and for that organisation to hand out child keys (e.g. Microsoft, Open Source Initiative, Apple, etc) who could in turn generate child keys (all of which could be revoked). Essentially we need the "internet model" of key exchanges for this too. I cannot…
"They are almost certainly going to be more secure than depending on some crazy root of trust based on a big company, with key signing authorities that trust anybody with a credit card."
Not to mention this kind of thing: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=476766
Also, when it comes to stuff this important, there is no such thing as a trusted neutral party.
Re: Torvalds clarifies Linux's Windows 8 Secure Boot position
#6The thing about secure boot is that it is a GOOD idea done very badly indeed. What was needed was for a trusted neutral party(or two) to be the owner of the root key, and for that organisation to hand out child keys (e.g. Microsoft, Open Source Initiative, Apple, etc) who could in turn generate child keys (all of which could be revoked). Essentially we need the "internet model" of key exchanges for this too. I cannot…
The internet model of key exchanges sucks, and there is currently much wailing and gnashing of teeth over what to do about it. That's what linus is talking about here: "They are almost certainly going to be more secure than depending on some crazy root of trust based on a big company, with key signing authorities that trust anybody with a credit card." Not to mention this kind of thing: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/s…
The main issue with the internet model is how uncompetitive the whole thing is. You have just a few companies handing out keys and they charge upwards of $50 a year just for the "pleasure" of having secured communications.
Secure boot would likely suffer from the same problem. But yet I'd still take that over this...
Re: Torvalds clarifies Linux's Windows 8 Secure Boot position
#7In fact the whole UEFI in general I think it is a clusterfuck of mishmashed random ideas, some good, many bad.
What I intend to do personally, is attempt to don't use secure boot.
And this all might explain the e-mail I got from Lenovo 10 minutes ago...
I asked them for a non-Windows machine. They replied saying that they from now on only manufacture machines with Windows. At first I was: "wtf? why?" now this article remembered me that now we have firmware tied to Microsoft, and this explains then why ThinkPads must come with Windows.
Here in Brazil this is illegal, and Lenovo for example got sued (and lost) once. I hope a rain of lawsuits make this shit stop.
Re: Torvalds clarifies Linux's Windows 8 Secure Boot position
#8I guess we need to hide all those forensic distributions that can modify and access data on a windows machine. To name a few: backtrack, CAINE, and DEFT. If technology can modify and access data, it can also be used in an exploit. Some might even argue that running a forensic on a computer without the owners permissions is an exploit in itself.
Edit: How could such technology be used you say. Package a usb drive that once plugged in, will reboot the machine and load a Linux distribution. Once loaded, it automatically modify the windows system and transfer any interesting data it find. Afterward, it erase itself and reboots, thus looking like any empty usb drive once windows boots up. If that is not an plausible exploit which an ordinary Windows users could trigger and become compromised, then I would like to hear the definition of an "plausible exploit".
Re: Torvalds clarifies Linux's Windows 8 Secure Boot position
#9The thing about secure boot is that it is a GOOD idea done very badly indeed. What was needed was for a trusted neutral party(or two) to be the owner of the root key, and for that organisation to hand out child keys (e.g. Microsoft, Open Source Initiative, Apple, etc) who could in turn generate child keys (all of which could be revoked). Essentially we need the "internet model" of key exchanges for this too. I cannot…
It's just that, well, there's only really one software manufacturer with enough clout to get all the hardware vendors to include its key, and it's a heck of a lot easier to just get a sub-key signed by their master key than pretty much anything else.
Re: Torvalds clarifies Linux's Windows 8 Secure Boot position
#10> What they've told us privately is that as long as no-one comes along with a plausible exploit for Windows based on using a secure boot enabled Linux system, they don't care what we do. I guess we need to hide all those forensic distributions that can modify and access data on a windows machine. To name a few: backtrack, CAINE, and DEFT. If technology can modify and access data, it can also be used in an exploit. So…
"This 'plausible exploit' has to be some way of getting ordinary Windows users to run the code and become compromised, it's not an experienced Linux user becoming root and subverting Windows on their local box."