We asked 15k European devs about jobs, salaries, and AI [pdf]
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We asked 15k European devs about jobs, salaries, and AI [pdf]
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Re: We asked 15k European devs about jobs, salaries, and AI [pdf]
#2I don't trust these numbers for Germany.
Why? Have a look at all the Tarifunternehmen salaries. 80k-90k€ is pretty much a standard salary you can reach after 5 years (with maybe changing your position once within the same company).
Feels like their dataset has significant sampling gap in some very big industries here.
Re: We asked 15k European devs about jobs, salaries, and AI [pdf]
#3Yeah, the numbers in Germany are not so rosy. If these numbers are true, we are looking at -
- An "average" salary of around 65K / year
- This after (an average of) 5-6 rounds of interviews
- 6 months of "probation", with only 2 weeks of notice
- And all after 4-6 years of degree/s and 4-5 years of experience (so around 10 years of investment)
Then after taxation 65K annually means around 3500/month in pocket. Then with the current prices - around 1200 goes in rent alone. Not a lot of room to spend after that. Then, prices keep going up and even a simple (new) car is around 20,000. Not to mention the stress / savings you have to keep since people can be let go anytime. To top it, there is a ceiling in Germany - unless you are extra-ordinary forget making above 100K ever even after 25 years of experience.
IT / software dev is a "barely survivable" kind of job in Germany right (sadly) now. I do not recommend it to kids in school/uni anymore (again unfortunately).
Re: We asked 15k European devs about jobs, salaries, and AI [pdf]
#4It basically paints 80k/y as the top 10% of senior salary in Germany and I don’t know anyone good working for less. While I only have anecdata this seems way out of touch with what I understand companies expect to pay for their talent
Re: We asked 15k European devs about jobs, salaries, and AI [pdf]
#5Agree with the sentiment that the numbers for Germany - and I would say Switzerland as well - are not on the level.
Re: We asked 15k European devs about jobs, salaries, and AI [pdf]
#6Yeah, the numbers in Germany are not so rosy. If these numbers are true, we are looking at - - An "average" salary of around 65K / year - This after (an average of) 5-6 rounds of interviews - 6 months of "probation", with only 2 weeks of notice - And all after 4-6 years of degree/s and 4-5 years of experience (so around 10 years of investment) Then after taxation 65K annually means around 3500/month in pocket. Then w…
But are they? A Berlin startup was paying this average salary to the Indian/Pakistani devs they sponsored and fully expected to jump ship in the next 12 months. Why would they not pay 70k-75k and have your pick in the upper half of the domestic market.
Re: We asked 15k European devs about jobs, salaries, and AI [pdf]
#7Yeah, the numbers in Germany are not so rosy. If these numbers are true, we are looking at - - An "average" salary of around 65K / year - This after (an average of) 5-6 rounds of interviews - 6 months of "probation", with only 2 weeks of notice - And all after 4-6 years of degree/s and 4-5 years of experience (so around 10 years of investment) Then after taxation 65K annually means around 3500/month in pocket. Then w…
Those numbers can't be right.
Re: We asked 15k European devs about jobs, salaries, and AI [pdf]
#8And this is largely why Europe totally whiffed on the tech explosion of the last 25 years.
Keep your golden geese well fed or they will find someone else (or another country) that will.
Re: We asked 15k European devs about jobs, salaries, and AI [pdf]
#9Yeah, the numbers in Germany are not so rosy. If these numbers are true, we are looking at - - An "average" salary of around 65K / year - This after (an average of) 5-6 rounds of interviews - 6 months of "probation", with only 2 weeks of notice - And all after 4-6 years of degree/s and 4-5 years of experience (so around 10 years of investment) Then after taxation 65K annually means around 3500/month in pocket. Then w…
Germans won't tell you how much they earn, ever. It keeps salaries down in all industries.
These fucking Tarifvertraege have kept salaries from growing, too. The people would have pushed a long time ago but the truth is masked well enough.
Those who don't believe the shit, earn more. It is sad and the change and progress happens elsewhere. Enjoy one or two decades of German companies looking like they still matter. Nobody will account for the reasons later on. It's a shame.
And an average of 65k to the average person is gooood.
Re: We asked 15k European devs about jobs, salaries, and AI [pdf]
#10These job portals (SwissDevJobs.ch, GermanTechjobs.de, etc.) are incredibly self-selecting.
I don't know any half-serious company posting ads there. And I'm not even talking about top tier or second tier tech companies, just tech adjacent employers paying market average.
Same with recruiting agencies matching people with startups. There was talent.io (not sure if it went under or re-branded) sharing ridiculous salary reports.
I'm all for transparency, but if your customer portfolio is literally paying bottom quartile salaries, I don't think this helps anyone.