Ask HN: Value of business/sales/idea guy early on?

#1

Post by BadassFractal » Fri, Jul 20, 2012, 4:40 AM UTC

Being surrounded 24/7 by engineers, I've never been exposed to the mythical "business/idea" guy persona that you always read about on sites like our very own HN. You know the stereotype: they have the great ideas, you work all day to turn it into reality, they reap all of the fame.

Back on Earth, how much of that persona is true, and how much is just software developer bias towards "suits"? Is there value that a guy who doesn't code can bring to a startup in a very early stage, when you're still testing the water, trying to validate the very basic hypotheses? If so, what kind of skillset does this person have to have?

Re: Ask HN: Value of business/sales/idea guy early on?

#2

Post by pedalpete » Fri, Jul 20, 2012, 4:52 AM UTC

I personally believe this is a balance thing. I used to be the 'business/sales/idea' guy, but taught myself to code.

So to answer your question, yes this person exists. Why did I decide to teach myself to code? I didn't want to have to rely on developers to build and test my ideas.

A business/sales/idea guy can overthink and plan all day. Build requirements docs, plan marketing, research the market, etc etc.

What they can't do is build, release, and see what the response is in the market.

Personally, I think it is a Business Canvas vs. Lean Startup, and I do see these two methodologies in conflict. I've recently witnessed businesses where people spend more time planning than it would have taken to actually build a beta and see what happens.

On the flip side, there are engineers who really don't get the business/sales/ideas side of things. They sometimes need that person to bring the business to them. However, I think it is more rare that an engineer can't find a business.

Re: Ask HN: Value of business/sales/idea guy early on?

#3

Post by BadassFractal » Fri, Jul 20, 2012, 4:59 AM UTC

pedalpete wrote: post #2

I personally believe this is a balance thing. I used to be the 'business/sales/idea' guy, but taught myself to code. So to answer your question, yes this person exists. Why did I decide to teach myself to code? I didn't want to have to rely on developers to build and test my ideas. A business/sales/idea guy can overthink and plan all day. Build requirements docs, plan marketing, research the market, etc etc. What the…

Would you say that a super-early stage startup that already has a strong engineering skillset doesn't need a "business/sales/idea" guy in most scenarios? I'm trying to think of something that I'd really need that kind of guy for that I just couldn't do myself.

Re: Ask HN: Value of business/sales/idea guy early on?

#4

Post by grkballer44 » Fri, Jul 20, 2012, 5:55 AM UTC

BadassFractal wrote: post #3

pedalpete wrote: post #2

I personally believe this is a balance thing. I used to be the 'business/sales/idea' guy, but taught myself to code. So to answer your question, yes this person exists. Why did I decide to teach myself to code? I didn't want to have to rely on developers to build and test my ideas. A business/sales/idea guy can overthink and plan all day. Build requirements docs, plan marketing, research the market, etc etc. What the…

Would you say that a super-early stage startup that already has a strong engineering skillset doesn't need a "business/sales/idea" guy in most scenarios? I'm trying to think of something that I'd really need that kind of guy for that I just couldn't do myself.

To build a business it takes someone who either understands the particular nuances of that particular business from their prior history or are capable of picking it up very quickly and effective on the fly. at im saying there's not value in testing a theory and not over analyzing, but an effective idea guy is necessary to truly disrupt a market. To win at disrupting, you have to understand a market as its currently is, all of its inefficiencies and weaknesses combined with future changes in capabilities and technology. However usually an engineer as likely to be an effective idea guy, combined with their ability to build and ship it puts them at an advantage. Great idea guys are rare, but when they surround themselves with the proper technical talent its a thing to behold . Tarantino, Jobs, list is endless

Re: Ask HN: Value of business/sales/idea guy early on?

#5

Post by patio11 » Fri, Jul 20, 2012, 5:58 AM UTC

A very, very good business guy can call up his rolodex and sell your software X times for 6/7 figures a pop prior to a single line of code being written. To do this, you need a) a rolodex, b) personal credibility, and c) sales skills. That guy is richly worth the half of the company he's getting in a two-man founder scenario.

Sadly, really good business guys are rare like really good engineers, and totally incompetent business guys are (bare minimum) as prevalent as programmers who can't FizzBuzz. There are many people who can, by writing their best idea ever on a napkin, deprive the world of a perfectly serviceable napkin.

(Really good business guys are priced higher than really good engineers, principally because their skillset necessarily includes not being totally stupid about money, negotiation, leverage, or scarcity.)

Re: Ask HN: Value of business/sales/idea guy early on?

#6

Post by BadassFractal » Fri, Jul 20, 2012, 9:26 PM UTC

grkballer44 wrote: post #4

BadassFractal wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you say that a super-early stage startup that already has a strong engineering skillset doesn't need a "business/sales/idea" guy in most scenarios? I'm trying to think of something that I'd really need that kind of guy for that I just couldn't do myself.

To build a business it takes someone who either understands the particular nuances of that particular business from their prior history or are capable of picking it up very quickly and effective on the fly. at im saying there's not value in testing a theory and not over analyzing, but an effective idea guy is necessary to truly disrupt a market. To win at disrupting, you have to understand a market as its currently i…

So, if I'm understanding correctly, you'd be looking for a particular market/industry insight in a business person like that. You'd be looking for experience, deep understanding and successes in that industry.

Is that more or less correct?

It also follows that without any track record, it's really hard to trust that a "business guy" will know how to contribute, and so you're taking someone on faith alone. It's kind of like hiring a developer who can't prove that he's ever written code before.