Linus Torvalds talks AI, Rust, & why Linux is the only thing that matters
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Re: Linus Torvalds talks AI, Rust, & why Linux is the only thing that matters
#2Rust
Switching to a more modern topic, the introduction of the Rust language into Linux, Torvalds is disappointed that its adoption isn't going faster. "I was expecting updates to be faster, but part of the problem is that old-time kernel developers are used to C and don't know Rust. They're not exactly excited about having to learn a new language that is, in some respects, very different. So there's been some pushback on Rust." On top of that, Torvalds commented, "Another reason has been the Rust infrastructure itself has not been super stable."
AI
"When AI came in, it was wonderful, because Nvidia got much more involved in the kernel. Nvidia went from being on my list of companies who are not good to my list of companies who are doing really good work."
Re: Linus Torvalds talks AI, Rust, & why Linux is the only thing that matters
#3Regretfully a major Rust for Linux maintainer just stepped down yesterday, saying he doesn't have the energy to keep dealing with the constant nontechnical nonsense: https://lore.kernel.org/lkml/20240828211117.9422-1-wedsonaf@...
Re: Linus Torvalds talks AI, Rust, & why Linux is the only thing that matters
#4Regretfully a major Rust for Linux maintainer just stepped down yesterday, saying he doesn't have the energy to keep dealing with the constant nontechnical nonsense: https://lore.kernel.org/lkml/20240828211117.9422-1-wedsonaf@...
I lack context. What is the “constant nontechnical nonsense”?
Re: Linus Torvalds talks AI, Rust, & why Linux is the only thing that matters
#5Regretfully a major Rust for Linux maintainer just stepped down yesterday, saying he doesn't have the energy to keep dealing with the constant nontechnical nonsense: https://lore.kernel.org/lkml/20240828211117.9422-1-wedsonaf@...
I lack context. What is the “constant nontechnical nonsense”?
Kneejerk pushback from old timers C-only kernel devs.
Re: Linus Torvalds talks AI, Rust, & why Linux is the only thing that matters
#6He talks of a new memory safe kernel disrupting Linux the way Linux disrupted others.
Well, maybe that's exactly what should happen. Maybe rust should have never been allowed in the kernel in the first place.
It's caused a lot of trouble so far and for what? The dev community is fractured and infighting is rampant.
Re: Linus Torvalds talks AI, Rust, & why Linux is the only thing that matters
#7Regretfully a major Rust for Linux maintainer just stepped down yesterday, saying he doesn't have the energy to keep dealing with the constant nontechnical nonsense: https://lore.kernel.org/lkml/20240828211117.9422-1-wedsonaf@...
I lack context. What is the “constant nontechnical nonsense”?
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41386939
A comment there has a link to a video of what seems to be the final straw.
Re: Linus Torvalds talks AI, Rust, & why Linux is the only thing that matters
#8He talks of a new memory safe kernel disrupting Linux the way Linux disrupted others. Well, maybe that's exactly what should happen. Maybe rust should have never been allowed in the kernel in the first place. It's caused a lot of trouble so far and for what? The dev community is fractured and infighting is rampant.
> It's caused a lot of trouble so far and for what?
The "for what" seems pretty obvious, no? It's the same reason you would use Rust over C in any other project. Memory safety and more modern PL features.
Re: Linus Torvalds talks AI, Rust, & why Linux is the only thing that matters
#9Earlier quoted context omitted.
I lack context. What is the “constant nontechnical nonsense”?
Kneejerk pushback from old timers C-only kernel devs.
Thanks for sharing. This makes a lot of sense to me. I’m not close to kernel development but any change to an established entity impacts the interest of people in it. So a primary obstacle change encounters is that it may diminish power people obtained in the establishment.
These people, while well intentioned in pushback, have difficulty separating benefit to the entity and benefit to themselves. So it takes a lot of work to impact change, and I understand the distance it has from normal technical work.
Re: Linus Torvalds talks AI, Rust, & why Linux is the only thing that matters
#10Earlier quoted context omitted.
I lack context. What is the “constant nontechnical nonsense”?
Kneejerk pushback from old timers C-only kernel devs.
It's inevitable in any organisations when dealing with change. Identifying resistance and coming up with strategies to overcome is a key part of change management. Telling people their reaction is "kneejerk pushback" usually does not help ;)
It's probably more difficult to handle in open source than in a company because authority less powerful and it's more difficult to wave both carrots and sticks...