How ‘Trainable’ Is VO2 Max Really? – A Case Study (2019)
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How ‘Trainable’ Is VO2 Max Really? – A Case Study (2019)
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Re: How ‘Trainable’ Is VO2 Max Really? – A Case Study (2019)
#2This is a good article and aligns well with empirical results from polarized training plans. But focusing on VO2 Max as a single metric isn't necessarily a good approach. Race directors don't give out prizes for the highest VO2 Max and it's only a mediocre predictor of finishing times. A lot of athletes benefit more from training to hold a higher percentage of VO2 Max for a longer period.
Re: How ‘Trainable’ Is VO2 Max Really? – A Case Study (2019)
#3This is a good article and aligns well with empirical results from polarized training plans. But focusing on VO2 Max as a single metric isn't necessarily a good approach. Race directors don't give out prizes for the highest VO2 Max and it's only a mediocre predictor of finishing times. A lot of athletes benefit more from training to hold a higher percentage of VO2 Max for a longer period.
VO2 max is good in that its easily tested. As such: its a microbenchmark (much like how Linpack FLOPs is touted as the supercomputer benchmark, even though dense matrix multiplications are probably in the minority of tasks)
Since there's a consistent test available that "microbenchmarks" an athlete's measure of endurance across athletic fields (bicyclists, cross country skiers, runners, etc. etc.), we can now compare athletes of different styles against each other and learn from all of them.
Re: How ‘Trainable’ Is VO2 Max Really? – A Case Study (2019)
#4This is a good article and aligns well with empirical results from polarized training plans. But focusing on VO2 Max as a single metric isn't necessarily a good approach. Race directors don't give out prizes for the highest VO2 Max and it's only a mediocre predictor of finishing times. A lot of athletes benefit more from training to hold a higher percentage of VO2 Max for a longer period.
VO2 max is good in that its easily tested. As such: its a microbenchmark (much like how Linpack FLOPs is touted as the supercomputer benchmark, even though dense matrix multiplications are probably in the minority of tasks) Since there's a consistent test available that "microbenchmarks" an athlete's measure of endurance across athletic fields (bicyclists, cross country skiers, runners, etc. etc.), we can now compare…
VO2 Max isn't a measure of endurance. It's a measure of maximum aerobic output.
Edit: Athletes with high endurance as measured by how much output they can sustain over longer periods will also tend to have high VO2 Max scores, but that's mostly a correlation thing and not a direct causal relationship.
I'm not sure there's any point in comparing VO2 Max scores across sports. It's an interesting factoid but not really actionable.
Re: How ‘Trainable’ Is VO2 Max Really? – A Case Study (2019)
#5Earlier quoted context omitted.
VO2 max is good in that its easily tested. As such: its a microbenchmark (much like how Linpack FLOPs is touted as the supercomputer benchmark, even though dense matrix multiplications are probably in the minority of tasks) Since there's a consistent test available that "microbenchmarks" an athlete's measure of endurance across athletic fields (bicyclists, cross country skiers, runners, etc. etc.), we can now compare…
VO2 Max isn't a measure of endurance. It's a measure of maximum aerobic output. Edit: Athletes with high endurance as measured by how much output they can sustain over longer periods will also tend to have high VO2 Max scores, but that's mostly a correlation thing and not a direct causal relationship. I'm not sure there's any point in comparing VO2 Max scores across sports. It's an interesting factoid but not really…
It's not, but it does correlate with the highest performers in endurance sports.
Re: How ‘Trainable’ Is VO2 Max Really? – A Case Study (2019)
#6Earlier quoted context omitted.
VO2 max is good in that its easily tested. As such: its a microbenchmark (much like how Linpack FLOPs is touted as the supercomputer benchmark, even though dense matrix multiplications are probably in the minority of tasks) Since there's a consistent test available that "microbenchmarks" an athlete's measure of endurance across athletic fields (bicyclists, cross country skiers, runners, etc. etc.), we can now compare…
VO2 Max isn't a measure of endurance. It's a measure of maximum aerobic output. Edit: Athletes with high endurance as measured by how much output they can sustain over longer periods will also tend to have high VO2 Max scores, but that's mostly a correlation thing and not a direct causal relationship. I'm not sure there's any point in comparing VO2 Max scores across sports. It's an interesting factoid but not really…
And Linpack FLOPs aren't a measure of 64-bit integer performance. And yet, we use Linpack FLOPs to compare supercomputers against each other, even if they're going to run 64-bit math on them.
No microbenchmark is perfect. But maybe some microbenchmarks are useful.
Re: How ‘Trainable’ Is VO2 Max Really? – A Case Study (2019)
#7Earlier quoted context omitted.
VO2 max is good in that its easily tested. As such: its a microbenchmark (much like how Linpack FLOPs is touted as the supercomputer benchmark, even though dense matrix multiplications are probably in the minority of tasks) Since there's a consistent test available that "microbenchmarks" an athlete's measure of endurance across athletic fields (bicyclists, cross country skiers, runners, etc. etc.), we can now compare…
VO2 Max isn't a measure of endurance. It's a measure of maximum aerobic output. Edit: Athletes with high endurance as measured by how much output they can sustain over longer periods will also tend to have high VO2 Max scores, but that's mostly a correlation thing and not a direct causal relationship. I'm not sure there's any point in comparing VO2 Max scores across sports. It's an interesting factoid but not really…
From Wikipedia:
"The measurement of V̇O2 max in the laboratory provides a quantitative value of endurance fitness for comparison of individual training effects and between people in endurance training. Maximal oxygen consumption reflects cardiorespiratory fitness and endurance capacity in exercise performance. Elite athletes, such as competitive distance runners, racing cyclists or Olympic cross-country skiers, can achieve V̇O2 max values exceeding 90 mL/(kg·min), while some endurance animals, such as Alaskan huskies, have V̇O2 max values exceeding 200 mL/(kg·min)."
So maybe it is a measurement of "endurance capacity"...
[edited for clarity]
Re: How ‘Trainable’ Is VO2 Max Really? – A Case Study (2019)
#8This is a good article and aligns well with empirical results from polarized training plans. But focusing on VO2 Max as a single metric isn't necessarily a good approach. Race directors don't give out prizes for the highest VO2 Max and it's only a mediocre predictor of finishing times. A lot of athletes benefit more from training to hold a higher percentage of VO2 Max for a longer period.
Although the article mentions "polarization", when I look at the intensity distribution graph, is that not more an example of "pyramidal" - ie with a substantial amount of work between easy and hardest (VO2) intensities (see the bars for aerobic, tempo, threshold), rather than just being divvied up between Easy/VO2 with no-mans land in the middle.
(see for instance, the definitions in this paper: https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fphys.2015.0029...)
Re: How ‘Trainable’ Is VO2 Max Really? – A Case Study (2019)
#9This is a good article and aligns well with empirical results from polarized training plans. But focusing on VO2 Max as a single metric isn't necessarily a good approach. Race directors don't give out prizes for the highest VO2 Max and it's only a mediocre predictor of finishing times. A lot of athletes benefit more from training to hold a higher percentage of VO2 Max for a longer period.
Yeah, many more metrics to look at as well. Like lactate threshold (often measured relative to pace in running, or wattage in cycling (FTP)). And while they correlate, even they cannot even predict performance.
For instance I measured my ftp, did a training plan and measured again. No change, but still got better results on my rides. Real world cycling is "punchy" with accelerations and hills etc. So my steady state performance hadn't increased, but my ability to endure going over lactate threshold and come back had.
And also the other way. When my friend started cycling, he was already an insane runner with good vo2max (70+). But his ftp on cycling was comparably low, since his muscles couldn't handle that lactate build up from this unknown moving pattern. Of course he quickly improved, but it's another point showing that vo2max doesn't necessarily translate to performance in an event. (One could argue him redoing the vo2max test on a bike would have yielded a different score, though)
Re: How ‘Trainable’ Is VO2 Max Really? – A Case Study (2019)
#10I wonder if VO2 max is equivalent to more O2 diffused to cells.. what if capillaries are too narrow or too twisted, you get a lot of O2 circulating but very few reaching the cells.