Java Is Underhyped

#1

Post by Jaxkr » Fri, Apr 16, 2021, 12:13 AM UTC

Re: Java Is Underhyped

#2

Post by Jaxkr » Fri, Apr 16, 2021, 12:25 AM UTC

Thanks for the two upvotes so far! Please feel free to leave criticism of the article or my writing; I'm trying to strengthen my composition muscle.

Re: Java Is Underhyped

#3

Post by offtop5 » Fri, Apr 16, 2021, 12:52 AM UTC

Java is under hyped in the same way Toyota Corollas are under hyped.

Nothing is exciting about it since it's so common. I personally dislike Java since I just find it hard , you'll never want for work as a skilled Java developer

Re: Java Is Underhyped

#4

Post by ntw1103 » Fri, Apr 16, 2021, 1:13 AM UTC

While attneding university, Java made an appearance in 4 different classes, the first two clases students take are Java classes. One interesting thing to note, is that for these classes, none of the students were allowed to use any of the Java libraries, or external libraries, everything had to be built from scratch. So I didn't actually learn about using external libraries or Maven until later when I started developing for Android. >"How many languages can you think of that meet the following conditions?" I think that dlang comes pretty close. The Dlang community isn"t super large, but I've found everyone I've interacted with to be polite and helpful.

Re: Java Is Underhyped

#5

Post by Jaxkr » Fri, Apr 16, 2021, 1:27 AM UTC

ntw1103 wrote: post #4

While attneding university, Java made an appearance in 4 different classes, the first two clases students take are Java classes. One interesting thing to note, is that for these classes, none of the students were allowed to use any of the Java libraries, or external libraries, everything had to be built from scratch. So I didn't actually learn about using external libraries or Maven until later when I started develop…

I had the exact same experience in my C++ courses: no external libraries at all. But those are a PITA anyways, even with CMake.

And I've heard good things about Dlang but I've never used it myself, I'll have to check it out some more.

Re: Java Is Underhyped

#6

Post by Jaxkr » Fri, Apr 16, 2021, 1:27 AM UTC

offtop5 wrote: post #3

Java is under hyped in the same way Toyota Corollas are under hyped. Nothing is exciting about it since it's so common. I personally dislike Java since I just find it hard , you'll never want for work as a skilled Java developer

Good analogy.

Re: Java Is Underhyped

#7

Post by theamk » Fri, Apr 16, 2021, 2:07 AM UTC

There are a few reasons to avoid Java today.

- The programs are very verbose for the functionality they provide. There are countless lines of getters, setters, and trivial constructors. While IDE helps to write them, it makes reading existing programs slow and frustrating. Lombok helps, but very few programs use it.

- If you do want to use Java ecosystem, there is Scala. It also has strong type system, nice IDE support and big ecosystem of third-party libraries, but is much more expressive and easier to read and write that Java.

- Finally, if you have to run medium to large java programs, you need to constantly tune the JVM. Unfortunately, you can't "confidently trust the JVM to do what's best" -- you need to get familiar with GC algorithms, manual heap sizing, GC tracing options and so on.

Java still has plenty of uses because it has so much code written in it, but luckily, the new projects are using it less and less. I really look forward to the day when I can stop tuning -Xmx option in start.sh files!

Re: Java Is Underhyped

#8

Post by jbluepolarbear » Fri, Apr 16, 2021, 2:22 AM UTC

Java is fine; just fine. It’s not flashy or fun, comes with 25 years of CRUD, and so many ancient, enterprise codebases you’ll never run out of soul-sucking positions to bring your toolbox. Except they moved to the new hot CRUD framework and you’ll have to learn it all again.

Re: Java Is Underhyped

#9

Post by king_magic » Fri, Apr 16, 2021, 2:27 AM UTC

The sheer verbosity of Java is just unbearable when you're used to Python/Go/Swift/etc.

No, Java is just about as hyped as it needs to be. Which is to say, it's more or less fine. Not great, not terrible. Middle of the road at best.

Re: Java Is Underhyped

#10

Post by seiferteric » Fri, Apr 16, 2021, 2:27 AM UTC

Jaxkr wrote: post #5

ntw1103 wrote: post #4

While attneding university, Java made an appearance in 4 different classes, the first two clases students take are Java classes. One interesting thing to note, is that for these classes, none of the students were allowed to use any of the Java libraries, or external libraries, everything had to be built from scratch. So I didn't actually learn about using external libraries or Maven until later when I started develop…

I had the exact same experience in my C++ courses: no external libraries at all. But those are a PITA anyways, even with CMake. And I've heard good things about Dlang but I've never used it myself, I'll have to check it out some more.

I have never been a java developer but I get the impression it is similar to C++ in the way that they were not that great early on in their history but have since been dramatically improved, but the old reputation persists to outsiders.