Nordic prison cells look like $3k apartments in San Francisco
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Re: Nordic prison cells look like $3k apartments in San Francisco
#2Well it’s pretty clear that nicer prison cells don’t encourage recidivism when you look at the statistics. So basically it comes down to social drives/desires...
The will of the people has spoken and citizens of the USA _want_ to see inhumane prisons because they feel the inmates deserve it. I don’t even say that while standing on terribly high ground... Australian prisons are much closer to American ones than Norwegian ones... especially for non-white inmates.
TLDR... Shits fucked and the thing I want most from the whole BLM 2020 protest movement is meaningful prison reform. Because it’s a long path to social reconciliation and meaningful integration... but it’s not anywhere near as long a road to prison reform.
Re: Nordic prison cells look like $3k apartments in San Francisco
#3Well it’s pretty clear that nicer prison cells don’t encourage recidivism when you look at the statistics. So basically it comes down to social drives/desires... The will of the people has spoken and citizens of the USA _want_ to see inhumane prisons because they feel the inmates deserve it. I don’t even say that while standing on terribly high ground... Australian prisons are much closer to American ones than Norweg…
Unpopular opinion: why do we need this? The people in prison are by and large human trash who have brought so much suffering to humanity. The quality of prisons in the US roughly correlates with the class of crime. I’d let it be.
Re: Nordic prison cells look like $3k apartments in San Francisco
#4Well it’s pretty clear that nicer prison cells don’t encourage recidivism when you look at the statistics. So basically it comes down to social drives/desires... The will of the people has spoken and citizens of the USA _want_ to see inhumane prisons because they feel the inmates deserve it. I don’t even say that while standing on terribly high ground... Australian prisons are much closer to American ones than Norweg…
> citizens of the USA _want_ to see inhumane prisons because they feel the inmates deserve it
While I think that's true, I also think it's missing another major argument: that prison is a deterrent. I don't know enough to agree or disagree, but it's a big part of the discussion.
My feeling is that Nordic countries can have nice prisons because their social safety net is so strong. Maybe they can argue that being a free, poor person in a Nordic country is still better than being in their prisons.
The same is not true in the US, especially when you consider how harsh our culture is toward people who suffer from drug addiction. Abject poverty is much, much worse than the prisons in this tweet, and we don't have good non-criminal options for people who are both poor and deeply addicted to illegal drugs.
You can imagine a poor person in the US (with or without an addiction) trying to steal from someone's house and ending up shooting someone. If they go to a dangerous, filthy prison, they're probably worse off than when they were free.
If they go to a Nordic-style prison, their lifestyle has actually upgraded quite a lot. My understanding is that the latter option, the Nordic prison, would reduce their likelihood of having to resort to crime in the future.
But the question is how much violent crime is deterred by fear of prison and whether the Nordic style of prisons would instill enough fear.
I think I'm on the side of having nicer prisons, but I don't really know enough about it.
Re: Nordic prison cells look like $3k apartments in San Francisco
#5Well it’s pretty clear that nicer prison cells don’t encourage recidivism when you look at the statistics. So basically it comes down to social drives/desires... The will of the people has spoken and citizens of the USA _want_ to see inhumane prisons because they feel the inmates deserve it. I don’t even say that while standing on terribly high ground... Australian prisons are much closer to American ones than Norweg…
Unpopular opinion: why do we need this? The people in prison are by and large human trash who have brought so much suffering to humanity. The quality of prisons in the US roughly correlates with the class of crime. I’d let it be.
Yeah. If you smoke weed, you deserve what you get.
Re: Nordic prison cells look like $3k apartments in San Francisco
#6The US justice system is obviously totally broken, but one would do well to remember the absolutely incredible side of the Norwegian sovereign wealth fund.
Re: Nordic prison cells look like $3k apartments in San Francisco
#7Well it’s pretty clear that nicer prison cells don’t encourage recidivism when you look at the statistics. So basically it comes down to social drives/desires... The will of the people has spoken and citizens of the USA _want_ to see inhumane prisons because they feel the inmates deserve it. I don’t even say that while standing on terribly high ground... Australian prisons are much closer to American ones than Norweg…
I think one of the biggest drivers in US prison conditions is cost. The percent of the population that is incarcerated is quite high. This would increase the per tax payer cost to support the system, while also shrinking tax revenue (people in prison generally aren't making money to pay tax on).
I agree that reforms are needed. It would also be great to see a reduction in the incarceration rate by relying on other punitive measures when possible. And that people actual get a speedy trial instead of waiting years. And officers/judges actually following rule of law.
I think the real root issue of all of this is that the majority of people have no idea or experience in how broken to system is. The idea that people deserve it, and even seen that many people don't laws/rights and simply assume someone charged is likely guilty.
Re: Nordic prison cells look like $3k apartments in San Francisco
#8That says more about SF, but I think the author would agree.
Re: Nordic prison cells look like $3k apartments in San Francisco
#9The US justice system is obviously totally broken, but one would do well to remember the absolutely incredible side of the Norwegian sovereign wealth fund.
How much of the wealth fund is spent on incarceration?
Re: Nordic prison cells look like $3k apartments in San Francisco
#10Sentencing in Nordic countries is also much less than what you would expect for a similar crime in the US, there is no death penalty and the prison system is focused on reforming inmates and getting them back into society. Basically the exact opposite of the United States prison system.