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Global Mass Surveillance – The Fourteen Eyes

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Re: Global Mass Surveillance – The Fourteen Eyes

#6

Post by jjcon »

I think it is important that we all take a second to realize that surveillance can be a reasonable apparatus of a well maintained democracy. We should strive to have proper checks and balances on those powers rather than pretend they are not useful or do not exist. With proper checks surveillance can greatly improve national security but it should be kept to that domain and we should seek to prevent abuses.

I think us in the EU are due for a Snowden moment at some point here - the public is pretty in the dark on the level of surveillance pervading EU countries. I think it would be better if it was more transparent because we could actually have these discussions and work to prevent abuses.

Re: Global Mass Surveillance – The Fourteen Eyes

#7

Post by mindslight »

This is treason, plain and simple.

Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort

Foreign spy agencies, even of friendly countries, are our enemies due to their continual mission of attacking us with surveillance. But rather than working to defend the people against these attacks, NSA has chosen to conspire with the attackers!

Re: Global Mass Surveillance – The Fourteen Eyes

#8

Post by adrianN »

jjcon wrote: post #6

I think it is important that we all take a second to realize that surveillance can be a reasonable apparatus of a well maintained democracy. We should strive to have proper checks and balances on those powers rather than pretend they are not useful or do not exist. With proper checks surveillance can greatly improve national security but it should be kept to that domain and we should seek to prevent abuses. I think u…

How would such proper checks look like? I don't know of a country which I would trust to protect such data from misuse in day to day policing. Even more concerning is what happens if the country becomes less democratic but the surveillance infrastructure is still there.

Re: Global Mass Surveillance – The Fourteen Eyes

#9

Post by swader999 »

mindslight wrote: post #7

This is treason, plain and simple. Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort Foreign spy agencies, even of friendly countries, are our enemies due to their continual mission of attacking us with surveillance. But rather than working to defend the people against these attacks, NSA has chosen to conspire with the attac…

How else will we get around laws against domestic spying?

Re: Global Mass Surveillance – The Fourteen Eyes

#10

Post by ColanR »

jjcon wrote: post #6

I think it is important that we all take a second to realize that surveillance can be a reasonable apparatus of a well maintained democracy. We should strive to have proper checks and balances on those powers rather than pretend they are not useful or do not exist. With proper checks surveillance can greatly improve national security but it should be kept to that domain and we should seek to prevent abuses. I think u…

> important that we all take a second to realize that surveillance can be a reasonable apparatus of a well maintained democracy

No, I don't think we should just "realize" that. By all means, let's have a discussion; but to accept a priori that some form of surveillance is acceptable reeks of an outlook that has already given up. We should not be fearful and dependent, but rather willing to accept danger as the price of no one looking over our shoulders.

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