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The Harm of Studying Abroad

readingthechinadream.com

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Re: The Harm of Studying Abroad

#2
> The text translated here, written in 2008, has nothing to do with Zhang’s academic work, but instead reflects changing attitudes among younger Chinese intellectuals concerning the value of Western ideas and the experience of studying abroad.

> Zhang is surely right that doing an advanced degree in a foreign language is a challenge involving at times a loss of autonomy and a loss of status. More interesting is the overall tone of the text, which comes close to saying that the experience is a waste of time. This is not only because study abroad involves rote learning of someone else’s knowledge, but because China is the place to be. As Zhang puts it:

> “If you live abroad for a long time, you will miss many theoretically interesting things happening in China. Society in the West has been settled for hundreds of years, and not that much that is really new occurs. But China is entering a new era, full of potential.”

...

Valid points, for sure, but not everyone is reaping that new era full of potential. China is a great place to be if you've got the right connections, but no so great if you're gay, muslim, tibetan, or like to have opinions. Plus the great explosion of growth of China is now slowing down. Still many developments to come, for sure, but those may not play out in ways we expect.

Also think it's hilarious that he's bashing the U of C's "rote learning" when that's a huge part of China's entrance exams, or how foreign Uni's will limit your thought -- cuz the CCP tells Tsinghua "teach what you want", right?

Re: The Harm of Studying Abroad

#3
From my reading of this, this is just someone who was very isolated due in part to cultural/language barriers. I would be curious if someone who had the same experiences but was less isolated and had social nets would have a very different take.

> You sing the praises of whatever it is that your enemy opposes, and you oppose whatever your enemy praises.

That screams like someone who feels pushed out and isolated from their immediate society (in this case, the foreign culture they were studying in).

Re: The Harm of Studying Abroad

#4

From my reading of this, this is just someone who was very isolated due in part to cultural/language barriers. I would be curious if someone who had the same experiences but was less isolated and had social nets would have a very different take. > You sing the praises of whatever it is that your enemy opposes, and you oppose whatever your enemy praises. That screams like someone who feels pushed out and isolated from…

>I would be curious if someone who had the same experiences but was less isolated and had social nets would have a very different take.

That's me, and I totally have a different take.

I studied abroad as a foreign language major - but only after three full years of studying the language and culture of the country I was visiting. It was an enriching experience and I felt pretty comfortable navigating the country socially and professionally. Study abroad was a requirement for me to graduate. I did the longer trip after a previous two week trip to the same place. I met via skype with my professor back in the US weekly for an independent study course, and that gave me the chance to reflect and make sense of my experiences with a trusted mentor (who was a native of the country herself). The professor even dropped by to visit me in person during her summer trip to the country.

I think all of these things factored into making it an amazing experience and time of growth, as opposed to an isolating and depressing experience. Even with all that support and background knowledge I still dealt with my fair share of culture shock, home sickness, and isolation - all of which are important parts of the learning experience, in appropriate doses. But without the support system and preparation I had, I would imagine that the experience could have been very negative.

Study abroad is an incredible and enriching experience - but it takes a lot more resources than just buying a college kid a plane ticket to another country and sending them on their way. Of course that can be useful for a certain adventurous types as well. But institutionally, study abroad takes deliberate planning and support to make it meaningful for everybody who participates. Otherwise it can surely be just as bad as this author makes it out to be.

Re: The Harm of Studying Abroad

#6
Very interesting to hear a Chinese person complain about American higher education as too rote, as I've often read complains in the HN bubble that the Chinese system would be too rote. Perhaps things look too rote from either side if you're missing the culture-specific subtlety? Perhaps things are too rote on both sides but it's only noticed by those from a different background?

Relevant excerpt: "The things you think about are decided by your professors, and you follow their lead as you develop your thoughts instead of asking yourself what questions you developed from your reading or what link it might produce with your own background. So you just do your best to chew the cud and digest the material. And if you actually learn something, it is transplanted out of nothing and remains attached to its origin rather than sinking roots or sprouting branches. When study is nothing but rote learning, who doesn’t lose their appetite?"

Re: The Harm of Studying Abroad

#7
> Fourth, life is dry and boring, you don’t have friends or family, and you can’t sit around every day talking about the meaning of life. With time, you wind up really lonely, which makes you appreciate the vitality of life in China. When you come back, you’re like a bird let out of a cage, and your only urge is to fly. Who wants to study? Too bad.

Okay that has to be partially self inflicted. Too many people travel with no attempt to integrate with locals. I will grant that it's not easy, and many Americans fall into the same trap during their study abroad time, but that's perhaps the great allure and challenge is it not?

Re: The Harm of Studying Abroad

#8
To me, this reads as so much Chinese nationalism. Feels super consistent with Communist propaganda of an indolent West. Also, seems very suspect to criticize a lack of intellectual freedom by comparing it to a system without freedom of information. I also thought that Western education was widely considered much less about rote memorization and more about intellectual creativity and freedom, even to the detriment of western folks' technical skills. Even just the concept of a "liberal education" or a "liberal arts school" is a western concept AFAIK; I do think there is a lot of rote memorization, but I would think this would only be exacerbated in a Chinese institution.

Re: The Harm of Studying Abroad

#9
The whole article rings false to me. Although I get that it's Zhang's personal experience, but the reasoning makes zero sense, and it feels like he just wanted to vent.

Some of the points seemingly have nothing to do with studying abroad, but the nature of the university he attended, for example,

> First, you have no time. You read a lot but there’s no time to think.

This is has nothing to do with being a foreigner, or being in any specific country. It's a university culture, and every university has its own pace of teaching, in China or US.

And then,

> Of course, it makes no difference if you don’t go > to bookstores in the US, but if you bring this habit > back with you, it means that you don’t go to bookstores > in China

Seriously? How hard it is to consciously decide to go to a book store when you are in need of a book? This also seems to imply that China has no good libraries, which is untrue. I'm from a small city in China, and I borrowed so many books from the city library. That was how I got into programming as well, borrowing a book about Turbo Pascal.

Personally, I think the biggest difficulty for a Chinese in studying abroad in the US, is the difficulty of being accepted into the circle. You could make friends and acquaintances with Americans, but you're never part of "them". I constantly feel like I'm on the wrong side of a aquarium glass pane, being observed and judged.

There are two real choices: 1) pretend to be a white person and be extremely amiable, or 2) fallback to the smaller circle of Chinese people in US.

Re: The Harm of Studying Abroad

#10

The whole article rings false to me. Although I get that it's Zhang's personal experience, but the reasoning makes zero sense, and it feels like he just wanted to vent. Some of the points seemingly have nothing to do with studying abroad, but the nature of the university he attended, for example, > First, you have no time. You read a lot but there’s no time to think. This is has nothing to do with being a foreigner,…

The essay reads as satirical to me. Especially the ending line:

> My sole desire is that when future generations come of age, they will inherit a mature academic tradition, and will not have to travel such long distances and endure these various discomforts.

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