California is cracking down on the gig economy
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Re: California is cracking down on the gig economy
#2Increasing benefits and worker protections also increases the cost of hiring employees. This is widely understood. In countries where employees have extensive benefits and protections like France, employers are very picky about which employees they hire because it will be difficult or expensive to fire them if they turn out to be poor workers. Hence, and unemployment rate over twice that of the US.
The ease of entering and exiting the gig economy is one of its most valuable aspects. What other kinds of jobs can you set your own hours, and join and quit largely at whim? If Uber, Lyft, DoorDash, etc. all now have to consider their contractors employees then they will have to start setting hours. If they have to give their workers the same benefits as employees, then it will be financially unsustainable to let them set their own hours. People who depended on Uber for flexible employment will not be able to continue working.
This seems like political posturing that's going to hurt the majority of employees if it passes.
Re: California is cracking down on the gig economy
#3seems like same topic as https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20065910
Re: California is cracking down on the gig economy
#4Increasing benefits and worker protections also increases the cost of hiring employees. This is widely understood. In countries where employees have extensive benefits and protections like France, employers are very picky about which employees they hire because it will be difficult or expensive to fire them if they turn out to be poor workers. Hence, and unemployment rate over twice that of the US. The ease of enteri…
Germany has similar workers' rights and protection from firing, yet it has a lower unemployment rate.
Re: California is cracking down on the gig economy
#5Increasing benefits and worker protections also increases the cost of hiring employees. This is widely understood. In countries where employees have extensive benefits and protections like France, employers are very picky about which employees they hire because it will be difficult or expensive to fire them if they turn out to be poor workers. Hence, and unemployment rate over twice that of the US. The ease of enteri…
The problem is that most are not making much money [0] and most would be better off working a min wage job.
Most Uber/lyft drivers are recent immigrants , working poor who end up taking on a lot of risk for little if any reward.
Uber also uses psychological tricks to trick drivers into driving more then is rational [1]
[0] https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/12/technology/uber-driver-ip...
[1]
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/04/02/technology/ub...
Re: California is cracking down on the gig economy
#6From TFA:
Uber would likely have to reclassify tens of thousands of drivers in California as employees — something Uber drivers have been fighting for in court, unsuccessfully, for years.
"Fighting for in court" links to https://www.vox.com/2019/5/8/18535367/uber-drivers-strike-20... - which includes these choice paragraphs:
It’s worth reemphasizing this: Uber doesn’t want to pay drivers to take 15-minute rest breaks every few hours because it would cost too much, even though all US employers are required to give hourly workers paid breaks under federal law.
In the filing, the company says that dissatisfied drivers could become a business liability, as recent protests in India, the United Kingdom, and the United States have interrupted business on the platform. Instead of outlining ways to make drivers happy, Uber suggests it will just get worse.
“As we aim to reduce driver incentives to improve our financial performance, we expect Driver dissatisfaction will generally increase,” the company stated.
Sssssooo this maybe sounds like something employees who have been doing these jobs have been wanting for a while...
Re: California is cracking down on the gig economy
#7Increasing benefits and worker protections also increases the cost of hiring employees. This is widely understood. In countries where employees have extensive benefits and protections like France, employers are very picky about which employees they hire because it will be difficult or expensive to fire them if they turn out to be poor workers. Hence, and unemployment rate over twice that of the US. The ease of enteri…
The problem is that most are not making much money [0] and most would be better off working a min wage job. Most Uber/lyft drivers are recent immigrants , working poor who end up taking on a lot of risk for little if any reward. Uber also uses psychological tricks to trick drivers into driving more then is rational [1] [0] https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/12/technology/uber-driver-ip... [1] https://www.nytimes.com/int…
> The problem is that most are not making much money [0] and most would be better off working a min wage job.
$40,000 a year is hardly minimum wage. Most of the drivers I've talked to explain that it does usually equate to between minimum wage to $20-$25 an hour after expenses depending on how effective you are at getting surge priced rides. But, unlike a minimum wage job you can set your own hours which is a huge advantage.
> Most Uber/lyft drivers are recent immigrants , working poor who end up taking on a lot of risk for little if any reward.
Yeah, and what would poor recent immigrants be doing instead? Probably work that is much riskier (e.g. farm work).
> Uber also uses psychological tricks to trick drivers into driving more then is rational
I don't see any "psychological tricks" in this article. Telling drivers where the most riders are and where surge pricing is happening helps drivers get more money. And I'm supposed to think this is a bad thing?
Also, I would advise against trusting the NYT when it comes to reporting on the tech industry - especially large tech companies. I have observed grossly exaggerated stories and even outright falsehoods portraying tech companies in a negative light with enough consistency that I do not consider them a reliable source on this topic. Remember, traditional media like the New York Times is being decimated by Google and social media. Fanning the fires of the "techlash" is in their best interest.
Re: California is cracking down on the gig economy
#8From TFA: Uber would likely have to reclassify tens of thousands of drivers in California as employees — something Uber drivers have been fighting for in court, unsuccessfully, for years. "Fighting for in court" links to https://www.vox.com/2019/5/8/18535367/uber-drivers-strike-20... - which includes these choice paragraphs: It’s worth reemphasizing this: Uber doesn’t want to pay drivers to take 15-minute rest breaks…
Drivers want it, but drivers probably don't look at Uber's finances. Ask drivers this:
You would get the benefits of employees, but now you would have to work at least 40 hours a week and now those hours will be set by Uber - you will not get to choose your own hours.
Do you think they'd want that situation?
Re: California is cracking down on the gig economy
#9Earlier quoted context omitted.
The problem is that most are not making much money [0] and most would be better off working a min wage job. Most Uber/lyft drivers are recent immigrants , working poor who end up taking on a lot of risk for little if any reward. Uber also uses psychological tricks to trick drivers into driving more then is rational [1] [0] https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/12/technology/uber-driver-ip... [1] https://www.nytimes.com/int…
> The problem is that most are not making much money [0] and most would be better off working a min wage job. $40,000 a year is hardly minimum wage. Most of the drivers I've talked to explain that it does usually equate to between minimum wage to $20-$25 an hour after expenses depending on how effective you are at getting surge priced rides. But, unlike a minimum wage job you can set your own hours which is a huge ad…
>>$40,000 a year is hardly minimum wage.
No, but it gets pretty close when you factor in all the expenses that contractors have to deal with.
Re: California is cracking down on the gig economy
#10Increasing benefits and worker protections also increases the cost of hiring employees. This is widely understood. In countries where employees have extensive benefits and protections like France, employers are very picky about which employees they hire because it will be difficult or expensive to fire them if they turn out to be poor workers. Hence, and unemployment rate over twice that of the US. The ease of enteri…
Germany has similar workers' rights and protection from firing, yet it has a lower unemployment rate.
Its still easier to fire employees in Germany than in France from what I understand. Germany also has also averaged roughly half the yearly population growth rate as compared to France for the last several decades (even dipping into the negatives for several years). So the supply of labor is more constrained.