Serious flaws leave WPA3 vulnerable to hacks that steal Wi-Fi passwords
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Re: Serious flaws leave WPA3 vulnerable to hacks that steal Wi-Fi passwords
#2For some reason I'm surprised we've had so many issues with Wi-Fi security.
I don't know if it was addressed in WPA3 (or if it would be addressed there), but my understanding is that a good chunk of the protocol isn't authenticated at all, such as the de-auth packets.
In a world with growing HTTPS support, OpenVPN, WireGuard, etc. and we can't secure a wifi network with a shared key?
Re: Serious flaws leave WPA3 vulnerable to hacks that steal Wi-Fi passwords
#3For some reason I'm surprised we've had so many issues with Wi-Fi security. I don't know if it was addressed in WPA3 (or if it would be addressed there), but my understanding is that a good chunk of the protocol isn't authenticated at all, such as the de-auth packets. In a world with growing HTTPS support, OpenVPN, WireGuard, etc. and we can't secure a wifi network with a shared key?
You get protected management frames with 802.11w, WPA3 has it by default. Vendor support for it, in my experience, has been pretty bad however.
Re: Serious flaws leave WPA3 vulnerable to hacks that steal Wi-Fi passwords
#4Downgrade attacks:
WPA3 has a transitional mode which allows legacy WPA2 clients to connect. In this mode legacy WPA2 security issues are still present. Is this really a discovery or a given? How is WPA3 supposed to protect against it without requiring either WPA2 clients to be upgraded to support WPA3 security fixes (in which case you don't need WPA2 support anymore anyways) or without dropping support for transitional mode? 802.11w fixes much of this but WPA2 didn't mandate support for this which is one of the big reasons WPA3 is so much better.
Dragonfly downgrade:
"The hack can force the access point to use a different curve, presumably one that’s weaker." note: not "The hack can force the access point to use a different curve, one that’s weak.".
Side channel leaks:
Are failures in implementations not WPA3. If you're allowing local timing attacks while generating your keys it doesn't really matter what protocol you're using you've just failed. A real discovery of things in the wild that need to be fixed but nothing to do with the security of the specification.
Denial of service:
It's far more effective and simple to DoS the air than to DoS the APs CPU anyways. Always has been always will be. Besides, would you rather it be faster and have the AP expose side channel attacks instead?
"dragonblood":
Makes me think some researchers were out for their 5 minutes of fame with a cool sounding "vulnerability". To be a little less critical the researches discovered in-the-wild side channel attacks on popular client implementations of the crypto (but that doesn't sound as cool as "serious flaws leave WPA3 vulnerable".
Re: Serious flaws leave WPA3 vulnerable to hacks that steal Wi-Fi passwords
#5For some reason I'm surprised we've had so many issues with Wi-Fi security. I don't know if it was addressed in WPA3 (or if it would be addressed there), but my understanding is that a good chunk of the protocol isn't authenticated at all, such as the de-auth packets. In a world with growing HTTPS support, OpenVPN, WireGuard, etc. and we can't secure a wifi network with a shared key?
You get protected management frames with 802.11w, WPA3 has it by default. Vendor support for it, in my experience, has been pretty bad however.
I know that the 802.11 means it's a standard for a wireless communication protocol, but I'm only familiar with 802.11b/a/g/n/ac (because they are on the admin page of my router).
How do I now whether my WiFi supports 802.11w or any of the other countless 802.x family of standards that would be nice to have?
Are there any good overviews to these things?
Re: Serious flaws leave WPA3 vulnerable to hacks that steal Wi-Fi passwords
#6Earlier quoted context omitted.
You get protected management frames with 802.11w, WPA3 has it by default. Vendor support for it, in my experience, has been pretty bad however.
I know that the 802.11 means it's a standard for a wireless communication protocol, but I'm only familiar with 802.11b/a/g/n/ac (because they are on the admin page of my router). How do I now whether my WiFi supports 802.11w or any of the other countless 802.x family of standards that would be nice to have? Are there any good overviews to these things?
You can search for "MFP", "PMF", "Management Frame Protection", or "Protected Management Frames" in your Wi-Fi router's settings. Second best way is to look up the chipset in your router online.
Going forward anything you buy with WPA3 will support this feature though as it is a requirement to be certified now.
Re: Serious flaws leave WPA3 vulnerable to hacks that steal Wi-Fi passwords
#7For some reason I'm surprised we've had so many issues with Wi-Fi security. I don't know if it was addressed in WPA3 (or if it would be addressed there), but my understanding is that a good chunk of the protocol isn't authenticated at all, such as the de-auth packets. In a world with growing HTTPS support, OpenVPN, WireGuard, etc. and we can't secure a wifi network with a shared key?
The reason we have had so many problems is because these "standards" are not vetted by third-parties and therefore not allowed to test the security of these standards. The Alliance is a closed members-only committee, so yeah I don't doubt we will keep seeing these issues crop up.
Re: Serious flaws leave WPA3 vulnerable to hacks that steal Wi-Fi passwords
#8Earlier quoted context omitted.
You get protected management frames with 802.11w, WPA3 has it by default. Vendor support for it, in my experience, has been pretty bad however.
I know that the 802.11 means it's a standard for a wireless communication protocol, but I'm only familiar with 802.11b/a/g/n/ac (because they are on the admin page of my router). How do I now whether my WiFi supports 802.11w or any of the other countless 802.x family of standards that would be nice to have? Are there any good overviews to these things?
[deleted]
Re: Serious flaws leave WPA3 vulnerable to hacks that steal Wi-Fi passwords
#9For some reason I'm surprised we've had so many issues with Wi-Fi security. I don't know if it was addressed in WPA3 (or if it would be addressed there), but my understanding is that a good chunk of the protocol isn't authenticated at all, such as the de-auth packets. In a world with growing HTTPS support, OpenVPN, WireGuard, etc. and we can't secure a wifi network with a shared key?
The reason we have had so many problems is because these "standards" are not vetted by third-parties and therefore not allowed to test the security of these standards. The Alliance is a closed members-only committee, so yeah I don't doubt we will keep seeing these issues crop up.
I'm not going to get into the ideological debate of if the standards process is open enough or not but let me pose this: Is it not more likely the fact WPA2 was ratified in 2004 that it continues to be of questionable security to utilize in 2019?
Re: Serious flaws leave WPA3 vulnerable to hacks that steal Wi-Fi passwords
#10Downgrade attacks: WPA3 has a transitional mode which allows legacy WPA2 clients to connect. In this mode legacy WPA2 security issues are still present. Is this really a discovery or a given? How is WPA3 supposed to protect against it without requiring either WPA2 clients to be upgraded to support WPA3 security fixes (in which case you don't need WPA2 support anymore anyways) or without dropping support for transitio…
The downgrade attack works even if both the AP and the device connecting to it are WPA3 capable, that part is not a given