The Importance of Donald Trump
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The Importance of Donald Trump
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Re: The Importance of Donald Trump
#2This story was killed by user flags, whereupon another user emailed to plead the case for the article as more thoughtful and substantive than it sounds.
The median Donald Trump article is obviously off topic for this site, but arguably his rise is also "evidence of some interesting new phenomenon" [1]. So let's try turning flags off on this post as an experiment and see if everyone can keep the discussion thoughtful.
Edit: I read the article. Trump is a natural subject for Rich, a political journalist with a (much longer) background as an entertainment critic. What makes the article good is that he takes Trump seriously and uses him to make 'serious' politics look buffoonish, reversing the usual trope. If anyone knows a better analysis of Trump, please post the link in this thread—I'm sure many readers would like to see it.
Re: The Importance of Donald Trump
#3This post got flagged and killed. Daniel kindly unkilled it at my request. I'm not a Trump fan (and neither is the article) but I agree with its counter-intuitive observation.
> In the short time since Trump declared his candidacy, he has performed a public service by exposing, however crudely and at times inadvertently, the posturings of both the Republicans and the Democrats and the foolishness and obsolescence of much of the political culture they share. He is, as many say, making a mockery of the entire political process with his bull-in-a-china-shop antics. But the mockery in this case may be overdue, highly warranted, and ultimately a spur to reform rather than the crime against civic order that has scandalized those who see him, in the words of the former George W. Bush speechwriter Michael Gerson, as “dangerous to democracy.”
It's no surprise that Michael Gerson labels Trump "dangerous to democracy." Trump is actually dangerous to the GOP establishment and Gerson stands for that establishment.
What does it say about American democracy that it takes a self-aggrandizimg billionaire to speak openly about buying politicians and offers to be bought in a presidential election debate? It's the job of the moderators to force such an issue into the open, but they don't dare anger the party for fear of never hosting again. If you watched the first debate, you can see that Fox News was tough on Trump (as they should be), but nowhere near as tough on the rest (as they should have been). Even CNN seemed to be a proxy for the Republican establishment in the second debate.
EDIT: Ross Perot was was the last candidate to truly upset the political establishment, and he also was a billionaire. Hmmmm....
Re: The Importance of Donald Trump
#4This post got flagged and killed. Daniel kindly unkilled it at my request. I'm not a Trump fan (and neither is the article) but I agree with its counter-intuitive observation. > In the short time since Trump declared his candidacy, he has performed a public service by exposing, however crudely and at times inadvertently, the posturings of both the Republicans and the Democrats and the foolishness and obsolescence of…
Well there is Larry Lessig, who raised more than his $1MM goal from smaller donors to run as a referendum candidate with the sole purpose of getting money out of politics. That being said, he has zero name recognition when compared to Trump and is certainly not going to be as "entertaining".
Re: The Importance of Donald Trump
#5This story was killed by user flags, whereupon another user emailed to plead the case for the article as more thoughtful and substantive than it sounds. The median Donald Trump article is obviously off topic for this site, but arguably his rise is also "evidence of some interesting new phenomenon" [1]. So let's try turning flags off on this post as an experiment and see if everyone can keep the discussion thoughtful.…
You could argue that the rise of Trump is not really anything new; Italy has had Berlusconi in politics since the early 90ies, and there are a lot of similarities:
https://medium.com/conversations-with-tyler/watch-a-conversa...
Re: The Importance of Donald Trump
#6There seems to be a sizable number of people who do not feel represented by the narrow range of options that the political establishment has deigned to offer them, and who are tired of having to accept what the powers that be have declared inevitable.
Because of the way the American political system works, this dissatisfaction seldom finds expression ("what, are you going to waste your vote?"), but when an outsider with deep pockets appears, suddenly it can coalesce around him.
Therefore, I suspect that the question of Trump's competence is moot for many voters. If you just want to break the way the system works, four years with an ineffective president may not seem like a high price to pay.
OTOH, I find it curious that the article found no room for a very obvious real-world parallel amidst all the fictional characters Trump was likened to. Twenty years ago, another first-world country saw a political void filled by a boisterous tycoon who paid for his own campaign. It didn't turn out well, nor was it over quickly.
Re: The Importance of Donald Trump
#7This story was killed by user flags, whereupon another user emailed to plead the case for the article as more thoughtful and substantive than it sounds. The median Donald Trump article is obviously off topic for this site, but arguably his rise is also "evidence of some interesting new phenomenon" [1]. So let's try turning flags off on this post as an experiment and see if everyone can keep the discussion thoughtful.…
You could argue that the rise of Trump is not really anything new; Italy has had Berlusconi in politics since the early 90ies, and there are a lot of similarities: https://medium.com/conversations-with-tyler/watch-a-conversa...
I think it's fair to see each of those two as new in his context.
The article makes a case for Trump as new: a pop culture character coming to life in real politics. The fictional antecedents he brings up are fascinating. It's a good article—so good it's too bad he didn't go the whole hog and resist any usual partisan swipes, but that's probably too much to ask of Frank Rich. I'd say it easily passes the HN bar for on-topicness in a political story, though we'll still penalize the thread if it goes flamewar.
Re: The Importance of Donald Trump
#8On a similar note: http://imgur.com/gallery/qpNZ7
While NYMag seems to be more about Trump revealing the ridiculousness of our political system in general, the imgur guy focuses on how he's attracting republicans by showing off specifically how useless their own leadership has been for the last several years.
Both seem like valid points, which need to be understood by everyone who hates the idea of Trump as president and hopes to find a way to defeat him (myself included).
Re: The Importance of Donald Trump
#9There seems to be a sizable number of people who do not feel represented by the narrow range of options that the political establishment has deigned to offer them, and who are tired of having to accept what the powers that be have declared inevitable. Because of the way the American political system works, this dissatisfaction seldom finds expression ("what, are you going to waste your vote?"), but when an outsider w…
Which country are you referring to?
Re: The Importance of Donald Trump
#10God forbid America will be ruled by Trump and Russia by Zhirinovsky, this is a recipe for a nuclear extinction event