Show HN: Nihongo – Study Japanese using authentic text from games, songs, etc. • Hacker News Board

Re: Show HN: Nihongo – Study Japanese using authentic text from games, songs, etc.

#81

Post by chrisvasselli » Fri, Aug 21, 2015, 1:08 PM UTC

mikekchar wrote: post #58

chrisvasselli wrote: post #2

Hey HN, creator of Nihongo here! I spent a long time studying Japanese vocabulary using Anki, Flashcards Deluxe, etc., but I found that studying using premade word lists never worked that well for me. Nihongo is built around studying the words you're encountering naturally through your own hobbies and interests. Flashcard packs are automatically generated from the words that you look up in the built-in dictionary. Yo…

I'm also the author of a Japanese learning tool: https://github.com/mikekchar/jldrill I have some advice for you if you decide to use spaced repetition in your flashcards (not sure if you do already as I haven't had time to look in detail). JLDrill is mostly abandonware at the moment and is written in very poor Ruby ;-). I don't actually recommend that anyone use it. It was written for me. I think the pheonix branch…

Very interesting! Nihongo does use spaced repetition, and it looks like there are some similarities and some differences with JLDrill. Here's the overview:

- When you select a deck, you study words 10 at a time in "learn" mode.

-- In "learn" mode, you have to get the flashcard correct 3 times in a row, at which point they are "learned".

- Every day, you'll be given a set of cards you've learned to "review".

- These cards use a form of spaced repetition. In order to make spaced repetition more approachable, I don't use time intervals in the same way apps like Anki do. Instead, each card has a level, and as you progress through the levels, the interval at which they appear increases. Each level takes three steps to get through, each of which has its own interval.

-- Level 1: 1 day, 2 days, 3 days.

-- Level 2: 1 week, 2 weeks, 3 weeks

-- Level 3: 1 month, 2 months, 3 months

-- Level 4: 6 months, 9 months, 1 year

-- Level 5: Never show again

- If you mark a word wrong at Level 1, it drops down to Level 0, where it will keep showing up in that same session periodically until you've marked it correct enough to move it back to Level 1.

- Getting through your daily set of review cards is encouraged as being the most important thing, adding new cards is secondary.

- We don't want to discourage people from coming back, even if they got lazy and stopped studying for a month. So we never build up a huge pile of flashcards for people to review.

Give it a try if you have a chance, and if you have any thoughts/suggestions I'd love to hear them!

Re: Show HN: Nihongo – Study Japanese using authentic text from games, songs, etc.

#82

Post by chrisvasselli » Fri, Aug 21, 2015, 1:12 PM UTC

elementalest wrote: post #64

chrisvasselli wrote: post #2

Hey HN, creator of Nihongo here! I spent a long time studying Japanese vocabulary using Anki, Flashcards Deluxe, etc., but I found that studying using premade word lists never worked that well for me. Nihongo is built around studying the words you're encountering naturally through your own hobbies and interests. Flashcard packs are automatically generated from the words that you look up in the built-in dictionary. Yo…

I would love to use this app! I have been doing something to similar effect for Anki except using web scraping/API of various japanese dictionary sites with python scripts. The whole thing is clunky and buggy and requires a fair amount of manual work (which i always intended to automate, but not had the time), so i would love to use an app that does this all well. Unfortunately being iOS only locks me out. I noticed…

Yeah, unfortunately it's all built very iOS-specific. And since this is a side-project for me, I'm not sure I'll find the time to make an Android version anytime soon. If I ever have the time/resources, it's something I'd love to do!

Re: Show HN: Nihongo – Study Japanese using authentic text from games, songs, etc.

#83

Post by chrisvasselli » Fri, Aug 21, 2015, 1:16 PM UTC

sharp11 wrote: post #65

chrisvasselli wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the feedback! 1. I actually just finished implementing romaji entry, and it will be coming in the next version update. Honestly, after implementing it, I can't believe how much time I've wasted switching input methods. =) 2. Thanks! 3. I know, I know! I really want to, but I spent a couple weeks diving into it and found it really buggy and hard to get right. I'm using Core Data under the hood to store this…

For syncing, look at couchbase mobile, which recently has added support for Core Data: http://blog.couchbase.com/syncing-with-core-data

Looks promising, thanks. I initially tried with iCloud syncing, and it was a mess.

Re: Show HN: Nihongo – Study Japanese using authentic text from games, songs, etc.

#84

Post by chrisvasselli » Fri, Aug 21, 2015, 1:24 PM UTC

Micaiah_Chang wrote: post #67

chrisvasselli wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By default, the backside of the card has the first "sense" from JMDict on it. This sense is supposed to represent the primary meaning of the word. You can also add/replace that with the other senses by editing the flashcard, or you can add your own notes to the back. I've found using the first sense works pretty well. Having the whole definition on the back is way too much for your brain to process, but the first sen…

I've been studying the language for a while, and recently made the switch to Japanese-Japanese dictionaries, after using EDICT for a long time. This has highlighted some reservations I have about it. The most available example (not the best) is 適当, where it can be interchangeably be used to mean "adequate" and "half-assed", sort of sarcastically. The definition being a mostly undifferentiated bag of words, without ne…

Yeah, it's definitely a weakness in Nihongo. I'd love to have a really well-integrated Japanese-Japanese dictionary, but I've never been able to find a J-J open-source database like JMDict/EDict. My solution for now is that you can tap on the menu button in the top-right of any entry, and open it in the built-in iPhone dictionary, which includes a J-J dictionary. But that's not a very satisfying answer.

Re: Show HN: Nihongo – Study Japanese using authentic text from games, songs, etc.

#85

Post by chrisvasselli » Fri, Aug 21, 2015, 1:27 PM UTC

jbergens wrote: post #71

chrisvasselli wrote: post #2

Hey HN, creator of Nihongo here! I spent a long time studying Japanese vocabulary using Anki, Flashcards Deluxe, etc., but I found that studying using premade word lists never worked that well for me. Nihongo is built around studying the words you're encountering naturally through your own hobbies and interests. Flashcard packs are automatically generated from the words that you look up in the built-in dictionary. Yo…

Sounds great! Is the code open source? Do you plan versions for Androind and WinPhone? We would like the latter.

Sorry, it's all closed source right now. There are pieces of it I might release as open-source at some point though.

As for Android and Windows, I just don't have the time unfortunately. This is a solo side-project for me. But if I ever find the time/resources, I'd love to port it to other platforms.

Re: Show HN: Nihongo – Study Japanese using authentic text from games, songs, etc.

#86

Post by chrisvasselli » Fri, Aug 21, 2015, 1:28 PM UTC

tomku wrote: post #63

chrisvasselli wrote: post #2

Hey HN, creator of Nihongo here! I spent a long time studying Japanese vocabulary using Anki, Flashcards Deluxe, etc., but I found that studying using premade word lists never worked that well for me. Nihongo is built around studying the words you're encountering naturally through your own hobbies and interests. Flashcard packs are automatically generated from the words that you look up in the built-in dictionary. Yo…

Really like the app, any plans to make an iPad/Universal version? Thanks!

Yep, I'm working on it right now! That's going to be the next big update. I'm aiming to release shortly after iOS 9 comes out, so September/October probably.

Re: Show HN: Nihongo – Study Japanese using authentic text from games, songs, etc.

#87

Post by chrisvasselli » Fri, Aug 21, 2015, 1:35 PM UTC

chrisvasselli wrote: post #24

MarkSweep wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which morphological analyzer are you using to do the deconjugation?

I actually ended up rolling my own. There are some tricky cases involved, and I wanted full control over it.

Actually, I should give some proper credit here. My husband Justin wrote this component, which turned out awesome. He's really into Japanese linguistics. =)

Re: Show HN: Nihongo – Study Japanese using authentic text from games, songs, etc.

#88

Post by chrisvasselli » Fri, Aug 21, 2015, 1:43 PM UTC

abustamam wrote: post #68

Is there anything like this in different languages? I think you could make a great language-learning platform with this idea.

Not that I know of! I'd love to expand to other languages at some point.

One of the tricks is that I think it's important for there to be a best-in-class dictionary attached to it. If users feel like they'd rather use a different dictionary, then you don't get their dictionary history as flashcards, and overall you create a crappy user experience for them if they have to switch back and forth all the time.

Best-in-class dictionaries require someone deeply familiar with the language, and specifically the pitfalls of learning the language, to make. So I think to expand to other languages, I'd want to get passionate learners of the other languages involved as well.

Definitely a long-term goal though.

Re: Show HN: Nihongo – Study Japanese using authentic text from games, songs, etc.

#89

Post by Nadya » Fri, Aug 21, 2015, 3:15 PM UTC

thaumasiotes wrote: post #70

Nadya wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

* internet high five * Awesome. I couldn't think of how to phrase the problem. "Short phrases with meanings that don't match the individual words used being parsed as individual words instead of the short phrase" is kind of wordy and a little confusing.

> "Short phrases with meanings that don't match the individual words used being parsed as individual words instead of the short phrase" is kind of wordy and a little confusing. These are called "idioms", or, if you want to be really technical for its own sake, "non-compositional phrases". But I note that, at least according to wikipedia, "idiom" is the technical term as well as the vernacular one. https://en.wikipedi…

You know those times where you need to describe something but are forgetting the word so you call a "bridge" "an elevated structure built to allow crossing over bodies of water and roads"?

That was one of those times... though I appreciate you calling me out on it. :)

Re: Show HN: Nihongo – Study Japanese using authentic text from games, songs, etc.

#90

Post by abustamam » Fri, Aug 21, 2015, 8:02 PM UTC

chrisvasselli wrote: post #88

abustamam wrote: post #68

Is there anything like this in different languages? I think you could make a great language-learning platform with this idea.

Not that I know of! I'd love to expand to other languages at some point. One of the tricks is that I think it's important for there to be a best-in-class dictionary attached to it. If users feel like they'd rather use a different dictionary, then you don't get their dictionary history as flashcards, and overall you create a crappy user experience for them if they have to switch back and forth all the time. Best-in-cl…

I'd be interested in helping out, if you decide to take this further. I'm a passionate learner of French and Arabic but I am not deeply familiar with either language yet. I do know some people who are native speakers though.