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Show HN: A platform for remote piano lessons based on the Web MIDI API

keyboardconnect.com

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Re: Show HN: A platform for remote piano lessons based on the Web MIDI API

#71

Post by DonHopkins »

jacquesm wrote: post #68
Bewelge wrote: post #61

This is such a cool concept, congrats on shipping! I've been developing a webMIDI app myself for the past couple of years [0] and adding a multiplayer feature is something I've been eyeing for a while. May I ask how good the latency is? Some feedback on the landing page: - As others already pointed out, a video example showing the app would be really helpful. - I think allowing visitors to try out the piano and only…

Oh nice, another HN'er that's on the same wavelength :) I'll give your app a spin and send you some feedback, meanwhile, maybe there are useful ideas in pianojacq.com that you can adopt.

You're both on the same midi channel too, so you'll play well together, and should compare notes and velocities, and send each other your running status.

(Where's my drum machine when I need a badoom psssssh?)

Re: Show HN: A platform for remote piano lessons based on the Web MIDI API

#73

Post by vidarh »

semi-extrinsic wrote: post #54
JoshTriplett wrote: post #40

This sounds incredible, and I'd love to try it! A few immediate thoughts: As a student, I don't care about a two-sided platform (which is what it looks like you're trying to build). I want to sign up for vetted piano lessons through your site, and purchase a USB midi adapter that you recommend. As a short-term MVP, perhaps point people to a known-working adapter on a site with an affiliate program. Long-term you migh…

Regarding "USB MIDI adapter": Actually USB MIDI is the lowest common denominator for MIDI keyboards. If you pick up any used MIDI keyboard less than 10 years old, it will have USB. Something in the $40-$60 range on Craigslist is perfect. The big choice for the beginner (or anyone) is how many keys do you want, and have space for? It goes all the way from 25 keys up to 88. Then going up in price, models will start to…

But it's a space where more expensive older hardware might still be worth it. E.g. my full piano size 24 year old Yamaha w/velocity sensitive keys and pedals still works flawlessly and the current version of it is still expensive new (at least from the point of view of a casual user...)

It's now connected via a cheap USB adapter to my Chromebook (biggest issue: latency of the - mostly Android - apps) planning to connect it to my Linux box instead.

Re: Show HN: A platform for remote piano lessons based on the Web MIDI API

#74

Post by DonHopkins »

semi-extrinsic wrote: post #54
JoshTriplett wrote: post #40

This sounds incredible, and I'd love to try it! A few immediate thoughts: As a student, I don't care about a two-sided platform (which is what it looks like you're trying to build). I want to sign up for vetted piano lessons through your site, and purchase a USB midi adapter that you recommend. As a short-term MVP, perhaps point people to a known-working adapter on a site with an affiliate program. Long-term you migh…

Regarding "USB MIDI adapter": Actually USB MIDI is the lowest common denominator for MIDI keyboards. If you pick up any used MIDI keyboard less than 10 years old, it will have USB. Something in the $40-$60 range on Craigslist is perfect. The big choice for the beginner (or anyone) is how many keys do you want, and have space for? It goes all the way from 25 keys up to 88. Then going up in price, models will start to…

Old schoolers use USB to ADB plus ADB to MIDI! ;)

https://68kmla.org/bb/index.php?threads/usb-adb-converters-t...

https://www.reddit.com/r/synthesizers/comments/3wefun/midi_i...

Re: Show HN: A platform for remote piano lessons based on the Web MIDI API

#75

Post by jacquesm »

DonHopkins wrote: post #71
jacquesm wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh nice, another HN'er that's on the same wavelength :) I'll give your app a spin and send you some feedback, meanwhile, maybe there are useful ideas in pianojacq.com that you can adopt.

You're both on the same midi channel too, so you'll play well together, and should compare notes and velocities, and send each other your running status. (Where's my drum machine when I need a badoom psssssh?)

Let's not get ahead of ourselves in the punning department, wait your turn just like everybody else and remember to feed emacs and pip.

Re: Show HN: A platform for remote piano lessons based on the Web MIDI API

#76

Post by thomasrynne »

During covid I needed to setup remote piano lessons. I tried combining two videos to show hands on the keys as well as the face but at the time merging the two videos added too much latency. I solved this by only using the top down camera and then adding clear perspex (from a plastic picture frame) at 45 degrees in front of the raised laptop and also pointed lamps at the piano players face (the effect is called Pepper's Ghost). This meant the teacher could see the hands on the keyboard and the players face with one camera. It also meant the piano player would appear to look directly into the camera - like an auto cue. I'm posting here in case it helps someone else.

Re: Show HN: A platform for remote piano lessons based on the Web MIDI API

#77

Post by Bewelge »

jacquesm wrote: post #68
Bewelge wrote: post #61

This is such a cool concept, congrats on shipping! I've been developing a webMIDI app myself for the past couple of years [0] and adding a multiplayer feature is something I've been eyeing for a while. May I ask how good the latency is? Some feedback on the landing page: - As others already pointed out, a video example showing the app would be really helpful. - I think allowing visitors to try out the piano and only…

Oh nice, another HN'er that's on the same wavelength :) I'll give your app a spin and send you some feedback, meanwhile, maybe there are useful ideas in pianojacq.com that you can adopt.

Ohh Hi! I've come across pianojacq before! Definitely love how clean the sheet music looks and on first glance the way the song plays smoothly even when you hit the note a little late/early works really well! That's one aspect I really need to improve.

I see you're also using Vexflow. Are you using a library to go from Midi to Vexflow format? It's a rabbit hole I sometimes wish I hadn't entered :)

@OP Can really recommend VexFlow [0] when you do get to implementing sheet music.

[0] https://github.com/0xfe/vexflow

Re: Show HN: A platform for remote piano lessons based on the Web MIDI API

#78

Post by jacquesm »

Bewelge wrote: post #77
jacquesm wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh nice, another HN'er that's on the same wavelength :) I'll give your app a spin and send you some feedback, meanwhile, maybe there are useful ideas in pianojacq.com that you can adopt.

Ohh Hi! I've come across pianojacq before! Definitely love how clean the sheet music looks and on first glance the way the song plays smoothly even when you hit the note a little late/early works really well! That's one aspect I really need to improve. I see you're also using Vexflow. Are you using a library to go from Midi to Vexflow format? It's a rabbit hole I sometimes wish I hadn't entered :) @OP Can really reco…

I used two separate libraries, one to convert the MIDI file into an in memory representation and Vexflow, then a whole pile of glue (not the nicest part of the code) to combine the two.

There are some aspects of that that I want to revisit such as the automatic recognition of decorations (for instance: trills) so that they can be shown properly but these are tricky problems and I want to avoid spending more time on pianojacq.com than on using it.

Lately I've added an ear training module but I'm not completely happy with it yet (hit Bb0 to enable a hidden menu if you want to play around with it).

Re: Show HN: A platform for remote piano lessons based on the Web MIDI API

#79

Post by williamcotton »

solresol wrote: post #35
williamcotton wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can get MIDI keyboard with 88 weighted keys. Also, there are plenty of electric pianos, like the Wurlitzer or Rhodes, that have leas than 88 and only semi-weighted keys.

You can also get midi interfaces for cathedral organs; letting you use the organ console to control midi devices, and also letting midi devices control the pipe relays in the pipe organ. Of course, whether you would want to use the OP's app in some giant cathedral is another question.

I had a Roland MIDI pedal keyboard for awhile, although not for organ music, but for accompanying guitar.

Re: Show HN: A platform for remote piano lessons based on the Web MIDI API

#80

Post by sloxser »

jerkstate wrote: post #32
Ferret7446 wrote: post #17

From what I've heard MIDI controllers are not good for learning piano. You really want weighted keys and a full 88 keys otherwise you won't learn the right habits or build finger strength. (I learned on a physical piano in person, so I can't speak personally about learning on a MIDI controller, but it sounds plausible to me.)

my opinion (as a dad with kids learning piano, who learned piano as a kid) playing with 88 weighted keys is like learning to write cursive with a fountain pen - maybe artistically interesting, but doesn't matter for the core skills. My kids are learning on 61 key unweighted boards and they're learning melody, rhythm, notation, theory, and all of the things that are about music, not about the particular physiological…

It is basically like electric guitar vs classical guitar though.

Nylon has a very different touch and tension than steel.

You could start a student on electric or acoustic guitar that wants to learn classical guitar by why would you just not get them a classical guitar instead?

Same thing with piano to me. If you want to eventually learn to play some Chopin there is no reason you would not start with weighted keys.

The modern piano was also not even popular until the late 1700s.

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