Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Show HN: Aragon – Everything you need to run your company on Ethereum

aragon.one

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 123 posts

Re: Show HN: Aragon – Everything you need to run your company on Ethereum

#61

Post by anigbrowl »

aaron-lebo wrote: post #46
primitivesuave wrote: post #45

Is there a way to pay for domain, DNS, and hosting costs with Ethereum? If so, one could build a wide-range of SaaS products that accept payment in Ethereum, and would be free of taxation and government regulation. While the SEC understandably exists to prevent defrauding of investors, this dashboard gives an investor perfect clarity into a company's financial strength and liabilities, and allows for an informed deci…

Namecoin exists, but governments are never gonna just be like "hey, don't pay taxes, no problem". What would be really interesting is if some day you could buy a self-driving car with Ethereum. With an Uber-like app that accepts payment in Ethereum, and blockchain investments to rapidly scale the business up and reinvest profits, one could see a self-driving car company dominate the market in a far shorter time than…

Yeah but what if a DAO doesn't have a physical office that can be shut down? It's very difficult to stop the spread of something people want to use, and will only become more so.

Re: Show HN: Aragon – Everything you need to run your company on Ethereum

#62

Post by TD-Linux »

pavel_lishin wrote: post #41
clavalle wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> one has the more general problem of enforceability of contracts, etc. If I hire you via a crypto-contract but then you don't deliver the associated goods, what recourse do I have? I thought the point of crypto-contracts was to make enforcement as automatic as possible...if that is not fully true, are there any neutral verifications services that can hold things in escrow?

A crypto-contract can't evaluate the work you've delivered. If we enter into some arbitrary crypto-contract for me to build you a chair in exchange for 20 currencies, and I bring you a stump I hacked out of the woods, there's no underlying system that can tell me to fuck off and that I'm not getting paid.

You can actually evaluate work you've delivered, but only for a very small subset of "work" - basically, things that can be represented and evaluated entirely with software. Here's an example: https://bitcoincore.org/en/2016/02/26/zero-knowledge-conting...

Of course, this is entirely insufficient to do something like "put your corporation on the blockchain".

Re: Show HN: Aragon – Everything you need to run your company on Ethereum

#63

Post by brilliantcode »

izqui wrote: post #24
monkmartinez wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Until is gets stolen and you can't prove you own anything, or?

Exactly.

So if Facebook ran on Aragon, and the shares got hijacked, tough shit? Zuckerberg can't prove himself? Some guy in Yekaterinburg is the new CEO?

Re: Show HN: Aragon – Everything you need to run your company on Ethereum

#64

Post by haywirez »

pavel_lishin wrote: post #41
clavalle wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> one has the more general problem of enforceability of contracts, etc. If I hire you via a crypto-contract but then you don't deliver the associated goods, what recourse do I have? I thought the point of crypto-contracts was to make enforcement as automatic as possible...if that is not fully true, are there any neutral verifications services that can hold things in escrow?

A crypto-contract can't evaluate the work you've delivered. If we enter into some arbitrary crypto-contract for me to build you a chair in exchange for 20 currencies, and I bring you a stump I hacked out of the woods, there's no underlying system that can tell me to fuck off and that I'm not getting paid.

Isn't this fully addressed by decentralized arbitrators and reputation systems, with a solid economic incentive setup? After all, we are just remaking human civilization on top of more efficient, modern platforms...the same old mechanisms will apply, they'll just (hopefully) work faster & better.

Re: Show HN: Aragon – Everything you need to run your company on Ethereum

#65

Post by smokeyj »

monkmartinez wrote: post #52
smokeyj wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> there's no underlying system that can tell me to fuck off and that I'm not getting paid No reason an arbitration clause couldn't be included in the contract.

Who or what backs up the arbitrator? This is why we have guns, police, prisons, and militaries and lawyers....

> Who or what backs up the arbitrator?

Ethereum contracts are turing complete. The payout function can be contingent on either the buyer or arbitrators releasing the funds. The arbitrators can be determined before hand or rely on an external contract that offers arbitration services. The possibilities are truly endless.

Re: Show HN: Aragon – Everything you need to run your company on Ethereum

#66

Post by vidarh »

primitivesuave wrote: post #45

Is there a way to pay for domain, DNS, and hosting costs with Ethereum? If so, one could build a wide-range of SaaS products that accept payment in Ethereum, and would be free of taxation and government regulation. While the SEC understandably exists to prevent defrauding of investors, this dashboard gives an investor perfect clarity into a company's financial strength and liabilities, and allows for an informed deci…

> While the SEC understandably exists to prevent defrauding of investors, this dashboard gives an investor perfect clarity into a company's financial strength and liabilities, and allows for an informed decision to be made without any official paperwork.

No, it gives insight into what has been done in Ethereum using the accounts tied to this "company". If investors are led to believe that this gives perfect clarity, that makes defrauding investors trivially easy by simply keeping things outside of what gets recorded. Keeping multiple books is the oldest trick in the book.

Re: Show HN: Aragon – Everything you need to run your company on Ethereum

#67

Post by plttn »

izqui wrote: post #23
monkmartinez wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What would the stable coin look like? I mean, we already have 700+[1] "coins." we are way passed the ridiculous stage on that front. [1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cryptocurrencies

A stable coin is a crypto asset that is backed by a real value. If you own 1 EthUSD, there is a warranty that someone will give you 1 USD for that token

So a meta-fiat currency?

Re: Show HN: Aragon – Everything you need to run your company on Ethereum

#68

Post by vidarh »

izqui wrote: post #28
JorgeGT wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your link talks about a conceptual project that isn't in any way running yet nor has been approved by the National Bank of Spain. How can Aragon companies comply with their INSS obligations today?

It is a responsibility of the individual to follow the laws of her jurisdiction. It is a global project, so we won't be working with every local regulatory body. Aragon is creating a framework (as an open source project) for running Blockchain companies. We don't provide legal advice nor services, we don't take any responsibility for a hypothetic bad usage of our software.

Then where exactly do you believe people can legally use this?

Re: Show HN: Aragon – Everything you need to run your company on Ethereum

#69

Post by vidarh »

izqui wrote: post #24
monkmartinez wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Until is gets stolen and you can't prove you own anything, or?

Exactly.

Now what do you do once a court hands down a ruling requiring said shares be transferred to a given person?

Guess what, they're not going to accept "we can't" as a valid answer.

Re: Show HN: Aragon – Everything you need to run your company on Ethereum

#70

Post by throwaway29292 »

monkmartinez wrote: post #55
pavel_lishin wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, you could have trusted third-party arbiters who would evaluate whether or not to release the funds on delivery of the good or service. But that brings on a whole new level of reputation-economy things you have to think about.

And how deep should that go? Pretty soon you will need arbitration for the arbiters. Has no one addressed the basic need of a justice system with these crypto currencies?

How about some image processing/object recognition by standardized AI interfaces?
Post reply on HN