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Show HN: I've built a nice home server OS

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Re: Show HN: I've built a nice home server OS

#51

Post by cassianoleal »

nikolay wrote: post #41
cassianoleal wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And what is a Linux distro, if not an OS?

Calling a custom Linux build a brand-new OS is like a car tuner claiming they built a new car. You didn't build the engine or the chassis; you just tuned it and gave it a custom paint job. It's exactly like a hairdresser - they aren't creating a new human being, they're just cutting, coloring, and styling an existing one. It's a Linux distribution, i.e., a "distro," not a new OS!

> tuned it and gave it a custom paint job

The way to interact with the OS is significantly different from almost all other Linux distros. There is no shell, no DE. This feels like a lot more than "a custom paint job".

Is Ubuntu an OS? Mint?

Neither have built the package managment system, or the kernel, the DE(s), the utilities (maybe some but certainly not all).

What about CentOS? Or Bazzite? Or even Android?

Is macOS an OS, or "a custom BSD distro"?

And if none of those are OSs, does a Linux-based OS even exist? If not, what's the point of the distinction?

Re: Show HN: I've built a nice home server OS

#52

Post by nikolay »

cassianoleal wrote: post #51
nikolay wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Calling a custom Linux build a brand-new OS is like a car tuner claiming they built a new car. You didn't build the engine or the chassis; you just tuned it and gave it a custom paint job. It's exactly like a hairdresser - they aren't creating a new human being, they're just cutting, coloring, and styling an existing one. It's a Linux distribution, i.e., a "distro," not a new OS!

> tuned it and gave it a custom paint job The way to interact with the OS is significantly different from almost all other Linux distros. There is no shell, no DE. This feels like a lot more than "a custom paint job". Is Ubuntu an OS? Mint? Neither have built the package managment system, or the kernel, the DE(s), the utilities (maybe some but certainly not all). What about CentOS? Or Bazzite? Or even Android? Is mac…

Yours is a distro. Period. When you create your own kernel, then you can make bold claims like "I created an OS," when you haven't. Be humble, and you'll be more successful. Linus Torvalds and DHH are the only two arrogant people in tech, but both have accomplished enough to earn the exception. Hubris has no place in tech!

Re: Show HN: I've built a nice home server OS

#55

Post by NekkoDroid »

cassianoleal wrote: post #20
TacticalCoder wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nothing is bug free, and telling people they will never need to upgrade/patch/maintain a system is a well-paved path to compromised systems. Of course nothing is. But there's a reason projects like "Talos" do exist: no terminal, no SSH, no package manager (how do we like package managers like NPM lately btw?), read-only filesystem, definitely no systemd, etc. And then a minimal number of executables. This does, def…

IncusOS is another - read-only root FS, interactions with the system exclusively through the Incus API, no package manager, blue-green OS updates (à la Steam Deck / Home Assistant OS). Talos on IncusOS is likely a very interesting stack that I intend to play with hopefully in the near future. https://linuxcontainers.org/incus-os/docs/main/

> blue-green OS updates

First time I heard someone call it blue-green OS updates instead of A/B OS updates.

Re: Show HN: I've built a nice home server OS

#56

Post by cassianoleal »

nikolay wrote: post #52
cassianoleal wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> tuned it and gave it a custom paint job The way to interact with the OS is significantly different from almost all other Linux distros. There is no shell, no DE. This feels like a lot more than "a custom paint job". Is Ubuntu an OS? Mint? Neither have built the package managment system, or the kernel, the DE(s), the utilities (maybe some but certainly not all). What about CentOS? Or Bazzite? Or even Android? Is mac…

Yours is a distro. Period. When you create your own kernel, then you can make bold claims like "I created an OS," when you haven't. Be humble, and you'll be more successful. Linus Torvalds and DHH are the only two arrogant people in tech, but both have accomplished enough to earn the exception. Hubris has no place in tech!

lol what? I have no distros or OSs. You're delusional and arrogant yourself.

> Linus Torvalds and DHH are the only two arrogant people in tech

Are you feeling ok bud?

Re: Show HN: I've built a nice home server OS

#57

Post by cassianoleal »

NekkoDroid wrote: post #55
cassianoleal wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IncusOS is another - read-only root FS, interactions with the system exclusively through the Incus API, no package manager, blue-green OS updates (à la Steam Deck / Home Assistant OS). Talos on IncusOS is likely a very interesting stack that I intend to play with hopefully in the near future. https://linuxcontainers.org/incus-os/docs/main/

> blue-green OS updates First time I heard someone call it blue-green OS updates instead of A/B OS updates.

Heh fair enough!

Same concept, I guess. I'm a platform engineer / SRE, and blue/green is a more common way of describing that way of deploying applications so I didn't even consider it could have a different name on the OS layer.

Re: Show HN: I've built a nice home server OS

#58

Post by hnarn »

jvican wrote: post #39
abrookewood wrote: post #38

Congrats on launching something (more than most of us will ever manage), but I am struggling to see why I would use this over something with more backing. There are a number of similar projects that have a very similar goal, but have the support of a large community and/or commercial sponsor: - Flatcar Container Linux: An open-source, immutable OS designed for automatic updates and large-scale container deployments.…

I use IncusOS in my homelab. It's a joy to set up and use. Migrated from Proxmox and manage all my VMs. Heavily use coding assistants to automatically set things up through the IncusOS CLI, translate Docker-Compose images to Incus, write bash scripts to automate launching new containers to use `--dangerously-skip-permissions` without fear of repercussions, etc. What I love the most about it is that it's possible to m…

As someone who has moved the opposite way, heavily using Incus and now checking out Proxmox, what made you go for IncusOS?

My gut feeling is that enterprise sentiment is leaning heavily towards Proxmox, fuelled by a VMware exodus that will only gain speed, and I don't see Incus really meeting the requirements most people have that previously used VMware, but of course Incus is awesome and you can't always pick technologies by what will be "employable" :-)

Re: Show HN: I've built a nice home server OS

#59

Post by hnarn »

andai wrote: post #15

This is relevant to what I have been learning about recently! I'm getting ready to launch an online game and I'm dealing with "how do I just run my game server on dozens of boxes without dealing with linux stuff". I don't really have an answer yet (leaning into "just get one really powerful box" lol), but my investigation into the problem so far has been pretty interesting. You can conceptualize the "my program + the…

> "how do I just run my game server on dozens of boxes without dealing with linux stuff"

A good first question to ask yourself is why you need to run it on dozens of boxes. You probably don't.

The point of Docker is not "I just want to run my program", the point is to bundle an application with its dependencies. It's one way to distribute applications, and far from the only one (despite what talking to some people might make you think).

As for the last part of your post, none of it is correct. Docker is not a "second linux to worry about" and considering unikernels in your use case is insane.

Terry Davis once said that "an idiot admires complexity, a genius admires simplicity". You say you're "getting ready to launch an online game", then launch it. The best way to do that is the simplest way, which in my opinion is running it as a systemd service on _one_ Linux VM. When that actually creates problems for you, solve those problems, and only those problems.

Re: Show HN: I've built a nice home server OS

#60

Post by imrozim »

abrookewood wrote: post #38

Congrats on launching something (more than most of us will ever manage), but I am struggling to see why I would use this over something with more backing. There are a number of similar projects that have a very similar goal, but have the support of a large community and/or commercial sponsor: - Flatcar Container Linux: An open-source, immutable OS designed for automatic updates and large-scale container deployments.…

All those tools needed hours to setup this just boots and works.
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