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Show HN: Server-rendered multiplayer games with Lua (no client code)

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Re: Show HN: Server-rendered multiplayer games with Lua (no client code)

#41

Post by ModernMech »

throwaway894345 wrote: post #33
nkrisc wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s a very different kind of cheating though. The kind of cheating this effectively makes impossible is cheating where a player has more information than they’re intended to have. If someone makes an AI that plays the game as a good player, then it’s effectively indistinguishable from a real player who is good. If they make it super-humanly good, then it would probably be detectable anyway. It’s still fair in the…

I’m also curious if an AI could process the screen feed quickly enough to compete in first-person shooter games. Seems like it would be difficult without extremely high end hardware for the foreseeable future?

I had students build this kind of thing in 2020 by screenshotting the game and processing it with a standard OpenCV pipeline. No GenAI needed.

Re: Show HN: Server-rendered multiplayer games with Lua (no client code)

#42

Post by brunovcosta »

LoganDark wrote: post #39
brunovcosta wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

good feedback! I'm seeing people really struggly with the control lag + speed. I'm always biased since I test locally with no delay when developing :)

are there any affordances for prediction or replay? you could try to help network latency by having the server resimulate a small period of time roughly equivalent to the client's network delay - it's not perfect without client-side prediction but it could help

It's possible, but harder than traditional client/server paradigm since the client here is generic so the predictablity should be based on something other than heuristics

I'm thinking about simple ML to predict inputs and feedbacks. Since the amount of data generated in the streaming is massive and well structured, it looks like a possible approach

Re: Show HN: Server-rendered multiplayer games with Lua (no client code)

#44

Post by aetherspawn »

lurkshark wrote: post #31
aetherspawn wrote: post #27

The latency is a little intense from Australia … but surprisingly not as bad as I thought it would be. It was playable. I wonder if you can use speculative execution to play the game a few frames ahead and then the client picks what to display based on user input, or something like that. Each frame is 16ms, so you’d have to work ahead 6 frames to conquer the nominal latency of around 100ms, which may actually be 200m…

What you’re describing is called “rollback netcode”. It’s a pretty cool chunk of theory, usually used for fighting games which are extremely sensitive to latency. This explainer has some nice graphic demos https://bymuno.com/post/rollback

This is awesome and exactly what it needs, but good luck creating a language that’s “signal driven” enough to encode it and then send all the possible states to the client.

If you were able to make it, it would be kind of a Hail Mary moment for making easy server games without the latency.

Re: Show HN: Server-rendered multiplayer games with Lua (no client code)

#45

Post by Scion9066 »

throwaway894345 wrote: post #33
nkrisc wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s a very different kind of cheating though. The kind of cheating this effectively makes impossible is cheating where a player has more information than they’re intended to have. If someone makes an AI that plays the game as a good player, then it’s effectively indistinguishable from a real player who is good. If they make it super-humanly good, then it would probably be detectable anyway. It’s still fair in the…

I’m also curious if an AI could process the screen feed quickly enough to compete in first-person shooter games. Seems like it would be difficult without extremely high end hardware for the foreseeable future?

There's already models specifically for things like identifying players in Counter-Strike 2, including which team they're on.

Someone has even rigged up a system like that to a TENS system to stimulate the nerves in their arm and hand to move the mouse in the correct direction and fire when the crosshair is over the enemy.

We are definitely already there.

Re: Show HN: Server-rendered multiplayer games with Lua (no client code)

#48

Post by fragmede »

ModernMech wrote: post #40
brunovcosta wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah.. As people are playing and I'm watching their feedbacks it is becoming clear to me that the main source of input delay comes from the distance to the server.. the whole game is running in a single machine in SFO, so it makes total sense this bad exp in europe I think this is inevitable unless I add some optimism/interpolation in the client Also, thanks for the feedback! I will fix the Abstra landing page try ht…

You're running this at the airport?

It's a Googleism. The datacenter is referred to by the nearest airport because airport codes make it straightforwardsto know roughly where the DC is.

Re: Show HN: Server-rendered multiplayer games with Lua (no client code)

#49

Post by Bender »

fragmede wrote: post #48
ModernMech wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're running this at the airport?

It's a Googleism. The datacenter is referred to by the nearest airport because airport codes make it straightforwardsto know roughly where the DC is.

For completeness sake this is not strictly a Google thing. Many companies use airport codes for their data-centers.
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