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Show HN: Futuure – hash-certified public prediction store

futuu.re

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Re: Show HN: Futuure – hash-certified public prediction store

#31
post #23
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A proof that the pok and its hash hasn't been altered since its creation.

You can accomplish this with plain old cryptography. No blockchain needed. There are lots of ways to do it. One of them would be for Fuuture to publish the hash to literally anywhere. Public + cryptographically verifiable + distributed + append-only still does not equal blockchain, as long as we're defining blockchain as something that was not invented before 2009.

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Re: Show HN: Futuure – hash-certified public prediction store

#32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like when Patrick McKenzie (@patio11) posted a hash about some Covid nonsense he wanted to be right about?

If it’s about releasing information on schedule that’s verifiably created with a datetime stamp and maybe also by user, then it’s not really about predictions, it’s more than that. It could be used for any info, and then verification is available for the who and when. The thing though that would make this worthwhile would be if it were decentralized, because you want universal verification and independence of some th…

Not sure if anyone is doing that as a service now but the old methods like post it to yourself in a sealed envelope or email are just as legally binding (ie not binding at all in any way) as the most sophisticated hashed blockchain you can throw at the problem today. There's a reason lawyers use signatures on paper over registered mail. We are talking about a part of the law where the last technical advance was to accept Fax Machines.

Re: Show HN: Futuure – hash-certified public prediction store

#33
post #23
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A proof that the pok and its hash hasn't been altered since its creation.

You can accomplish this with plain old cryptography. No blockchain needed. There are lots of ways to do it. One of them would be for Fuuture to publish the hash to literally anywhere. Public + cryptographically verifiable + distributed + append-only still does not equal blockchain, as long as we're defining blockchain as something that was not invented before 2009.

So these hashes are distributed. How do we know they haven't been altered since future reveal? How does one find the "true" dataset? Trust random people on the internet?

Re: Show HN: Futuure – hash-certified public prediction store

#34

I wonder whether predictions (aka "poks") are stored in encrypted form in their database? Knowing what people think will happen in the future is obviously rather useful information.

It would be cool if there was a relatively reliable way of creating cryptographic "time capsules" that can be only opened at certain date in future.

So something like, I encrypt message with a certain public key. The private key is guaranteed to only become available on 1st of January 2030.

Re: Show HN: Futuure – hash-certified public prediction store

#35

Blockchain is overhypered nonsense 99.9999% of the time. But seriously this is the one in a billion projects where you should use the Bitcoin blockchain as much as I hate to say it

Indeed, there was a service I used back in around 2008 that did just this. It wasn't about predictions per se, but timestamping content. They were called GuardTime. The company still exists, but the service does not seem to, anymore.

It wasn't based on a public, distributed block chain, but it was a kind of a block chain (without PoW, PoS etc. - which you don't need if it's run by a single actor). The way they built trust was that they did publish their hash (tip of the block chain) I think in the (printed) Financial Times periodically. That made it impossible even for them to forge the chain.

Re: Show HN: Futuure – hash-certified public prediction store

#37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True, it's not the same as hashing a password and comparing hashes - you need to decrypt your data. Encryption adds one layer of obfuscation for a bad actor that might steal the database but does not get their hands on the key. Plus access to the key can be managed differently than access to the database. Either way, it comes down to sensitivity of the predictions made and how users would react should they be exposed…

But there are other crypto mechanism for that purpose... see - Verifiable Delay Functions https://eprint.iacr.org/2018/601.pdf

VDFs are designed to take a long time to compute. To use them here, it would require someone to be computing the solution continuously between the time the prediction is made and the time it is revealed - that's too inefficient for this purpose.

Re: Show HN: Futuure – hash-certified public prediction store

#39
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it’s about releasing information on schedule that’s verifiably created with a datetime stamp and maybe also by user, then it’s not really about predictions, it’s more than that. It could be used for any info, and then verification is available for the who and when. The thing though that would make this worthwhile would be if it were decentralized, because you want universal verification and independence of some th…

Honestly (and I hate saying this) but you could stick the hashes in a public blockchain and get clients to verify. But of course this would cost money and any Merkle tree would do, but I can’t believe I just non-ironically suggested a blockchain for something.

Ha, I was literally thinking the same thing. This bizarrely might be something suitable for a public blockchain and its not using it.
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