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Show HN: Control IKEA Lights Using Google Home and IFTTT

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Re: Show HN: Control IKEA Lights Using Google Home and IFTTT

#31

Post by melling »

dpark wrote: post #15
melling wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess if it doesn’t work for you, you should skip the thread so as not to drown out the effort. Someday someone might come along and build the thing you want. Perhaps they will build on this project.

His criticism is reasonable. There is a line between valuable criticism and pointless negativity. The latter deserves the “if you don’t like it, go away” response. The former does not. The line is fuzzy, so err on the side of leniency. Now, if there is a flaw in the criticism, address that, not the mere fact that it is criticism.

It’s like people who jump in an a discussion about electric vehicles then filling the comments with “I won’t buy one until the range increases“. Their criticism is also legitimate.

People should simply realize the product isn’t for them.

Re: Show HN: Control IKEA Lights Using Google Home and IFTTT

#33

Post by dpark »

melling wrote: post #31
dpark wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

His criticism is reasonable. There is a line between valuable criticism and pointless negativity. The latter deserves the “if you don’t like it, go away” response. The former does not. The line is fuzzy, so err on the side of leniency. Now, if there is a flaw in the criticism, address that, not the mere fact that it is criticism.

It’s like people who jump in an a discussion about electric vehicles then filling the comments with “I won’t buy one until the range increases“. Their criticism is also legitimate. People should simply realize the product isn’t for them.

That’s also a reasonable response and if I had a conversation about EVs with a large group of friends, I would expect one of them to make that comment. I would not expect the person with that sentiment to simply walk away rather than engage.

Re: Show HN: Control IKEA Lights Using Google Home and IFTTT

#34

Post by melling »

dpark wrote: post #33
melling wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s like people who jump in an a discussion about electric vehicles then filling the comments with “I won’t buy one until the range increases“. Their criticism is also legitimate. People should simply realize the product isn’t for them.

That’s also a reasonable response and if I had a conversation about EVs with a large group of friends, I would expect one of them to make that comment. I would not expect the person with that sentiment to simply walk away rather than engage.

But everyone already knows they have limited range. You aren’t adding to the online conversation. You aren’t going to change anything.

Often in long conversations, people chime in without reading the conversation and several people make the same “observation”.

In this conversation, we know there are downsides to cloud-based voice recognition. Telling someone who built it that it’s not for you, doesn’t add any value.

Re: Show HN: Control IKEA Lights Using Google Home and IFTTT

#35

Post by dpark »

melling wrote: post #34
dpark wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s also a reasonable response and if I had a conversation about EVs with a large group of friends, I would expect one of them to make that comment. I would not expect the person with that sentiment to simply walk away rather than engage.

But everyone already knows they have limited range. You aren’t adding to the online conversation. You aren’t going to change anything. Often in long conversations, people chime in without reading the conversation and several people make the same “observation”. In this conversation, we know there are downsides to cloud-based voice recognition. Telling someone who built it that it’s not for you, doesn’t add any value.

> But everyone already knows they have limited range. You aren’t adding to the online conversation. You aren’t going to change anything.

Realistically everything in this hypothetical conversation will be things that “everyone” knows. Unless you’re discussing confidential info about EVs, everything is by definition public knowledge and probably even common knowledge. Most conversations are about opinions rather than facts.

Is the guy who comments about EVs having all their torque available from a standstill also adding nothing to the conversation? What about the guy who mentions the environmental friendliness? Or the one who mentions the environmental costs of lithium mining? Who is really adding to the conversation here?

> In this conversation, we know there are downsides to cloud-based voice recognition. Telling someone who built it that it’s not for you, doesn’t add any value.

And yet it’s the top comment and the top reply provides info about a platform that doesn’t have the same drawback. I think this is pretty clearly value added.

Re: Show HN: Control IKEA Lights Using Google Home and IFTTT

#36

Post by melling »

dpark wrote: post #35
melling wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But everyone already knows they have limited range. You aren’t adding to the online conversation. You aren’t going to change anything. Often in long conversations, people chime in without reading the conversation and several people make the same “observation”. In this conversation, we know there are downsides to cloud-based voice recognition. Telling someone who built it that it’s not for you, doesn’t add any value.

> But everyone already knows they have limited range. You aren’t adding to the online conversation. You aren’t going to change anything. Realistically everything in this hypothetical conversation will be things that “everyone” knows. Unless you’re discussing confidential info about EVs, everything is by definition public knowledge and probably even common knowledge. Most conversations are about opinions rather than f…

When you read the comment about short range and the environmental impact of the batteries, they’re often highly upvoted by people that dislike electric vehicles too.

So, my point about someone drowning out someone’s project is proven by the top-rated comment about how it doesn’t work for them.

Re: Show HN: Control IKEA Lights Using Google Home and IFTTT

#37

Post by tomtimtall »

gregmac wrote: post #8

I don't mean to diminish the work done here, but I can't bring myself to use any home automation that relies on internet and 3rd party services. The whole "I can't turn off my lights/adjust my thermostat/close my garage door because the internet is down" is a cliche these days, but also reality when you use services like these. There's a difference between core and nice to have services (eg, ability to tell you the w…

You sound like an old man decrying escalators because you won’t rely on any means of transportation that requires electricity to function.... escalators without electricity are just stairs, IKEA lights controlled through google home without internet are just lightbulbs controlled by the wireless switch. Just like your google home without internet is just a wireless speaker. In all cases it’s just nice features that are super pleasant to use in practice and preople just don’t know how nice it feels to have them until the experience them for themselves.

Re: Show HN: Control IKEA Lights Using Google Home and IFTTT

#38

Post by dpark »

melling wrote: post #36
dpark wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But everyone already knows they have limited range. You aren’t adding to the online conversation. You aren’t going to change anything. Realistically everything in this hypothetical conversation will be things that “everyone” knows. Unless you’re discussing confidential info about EVs, everything is by definition public knowledge and probably even common knowledge. Most conversations are about opinions rather than f…

When you read the comment about short range and the environmental impact of the batteries, they’re often highly upvoted by people that dislike electric vehicles too. So, my point about someone drowning out someone’s project is proven by the top-rated comment about how it doesn’t work for them.

So you’re just going to pretend that the top comment doesn’t have a useful and relevant reply?

Re: Show HN: Control IKEA Lights Using Google Home and IFTTT

#39

Post by melling »

dpark wrote: post #38
melling wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you read the comment about short range and the environmental impact of the batteries, they’re often highly upvoted by people that dislike electric vehicles too. So, my point about someone drowning out someone’s project is proven by the top-rated comment about how it doesn’t work for them.

So you’re just going to pretend that the top comment doesn’t have a useful and relevant reply?

Snips? It has been submitted 5 times this week. E.g.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16537734

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16544893

Re: Show HN: Control IKEA Lights Using Google Home and IFTTT

#40

Post by dpark »

melling wrote: post #39
dpark wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you’re just going to pretend that the top comment doesn’t have a useful and relevant reply?

Snips? It has been submitted 5 times this week. E.g. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16537734 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16544893

Yes. I don’t know if Snips is any good but it seems extremely relevant and the “I won’t use remote automation” comment led clearly to the posting of Snips in this conversation.

Putting aside Snips for a moment, my point with my last comment was to note that you took the “upvotes aren’t a meaningful indicator” tangent and ignored the rest of the reply. You ignored the fact that the criticism led to a meaningful reply and did in fact contribute to the conversation. You also ignored my questions about what constitutes actual contributions to a conversation. Is it just positivity? Because most of the positive stuff people post is still not new and it seems unreasonable to me to claim that criticism is at heart not contributing to the conversation while fanboyism is.

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