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Show HN: Long Range E-Bike

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Re: Show HN: Long Range E-Bike

#241

Post by jacquesm »

ridaj wrote: post #231
orforforof wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to ride a motorcycle, now I have an ebike. They seem equally safe to me, which is to say neither are safe at all if there are other people on the road. The only solution is extremely defensive driving/riding, assume no one (including pedestrians) can see you. This attitude has been embedded deeply in the motorcycle culture and is the best way to all-around responsible riders -- and it needs to be propagated to…

Yes the problem with ebikes isn't other people being aware of the bike's sound, it's the rider being aware of the risk to themselves and others. Maybe this is ingrained in the motorcycle culture, but it seems like most buyers of ebikes I know have never ridden a motorcycle before and were not riding bicycles regularly either. They just go "oh this makes my commute like that time I biked when I was on vacation" and ap…

The bigger danger here in NL are the elderly, who suddenly go zooming around at twice the speeds they had before they got their e-bikes. Accidents every day like that, nasty ones too.

Re: Show HN: Long Range E-Bike

#242

Post by groone »

jacquesm wrote: post #227
groone wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my opinion the throttled e-bikes should be treated as bicycles as long as they have pedals and are under 25kg and 250W power. That would legalize my e-bike that I have used for 14000km in city saving a lot of carbon emissions and not sacrificing much as I can park it in bicycle stand. Of course going faster than 20-25km/h in pedestrian traffic (where bicycles are allowed) is extremely dangerous. But from my experi…

Is that with or without the weight of the battery ;)

With the battery. Normal bicycles can be as light as 8 kg when using carbon frame. Should be able to fit your battery in a 25kg bike if trying very hard.

Re: Show HN: Long Range E-Bike

#243

Post by maz- »

mynameisash wrote: post #177
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As long as they'r not causing problems for other cyclists, They cause problems. Maybe not every e-motorcycle rider, but most of them take full advantage of the power to out-accelerate other bikers and double the top speed of everyone around them. Bike paths were design with typical cyclist speeds in mind. It's not uncommon to see a young kid flying down our local bike paths at 40mph or more on a modded e-bike, forc…

> Maybe not every e-motorcycle rider I'm not sure if people are using these terms colloquially or if they are codified in law or generally accepted, so I may be making some false assumptions here: as an ICE motorcycle rider, using the term 'e-motorcycle' to refer to what is effectively a no-pedal bicycle dramatically overstates the capabilities and gives a false impression of what such a vehicle/device is. While some…

Not sure if you've heard of the Sur Ron or the Cake bikes but they're RAPID. I have a modified Sur Ron and it's way closer in performance terms to my Husky 701 than an e-mtb or similar (peak power to weight ratio of about 0.3hp/kg).

People put pedal kits on them to try and hide the fact it's basically a super light motorbike but in my experience it's not really suitable for riding on bike paths or trails.

Devices like in the OP are much more of a grey area as it's basically impossible to tell their power output / weight on an individual basis...

Re: Show HN: Long Range E-Bike

#244

Post by otabdeveloper4 »

mikepurvis wrote: post #115
hendersoon wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depends on your country, really. Throttle ebikes are legal in the USA so long as they don't go faster than 20MPH on throttle alone. And really speed is what matters here. Who cares if it's pedal-assist or throttle so long as you aren't going markedly faster than normal people without any motor at all? There's no safety concern.

At a certain point, you've added enough extra mass to the vehicle in terms of batteries, motor, beefed up brakes and frame, etc that you need to start asking questions about how much kinetic energy it's carrying and what happens to it all in case of a crash. Silly comparison, but we wouldn't let a car drive on the sidewalk even if it had a special module that limited it to 5km/h.

Yeah, there's an argument to be made somewhere here about banning obese people from running. :P

Re: Show HN: Long Range E-Bike

#245

Post by jacquesm »

dncornholio wrote: post #232
jacquesm wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where I live that would be illegal for an e-bike, that vehicle would be classified as an e-scooter.

Doesn't any Batavus E-Bike does this? That's were I got my (limited) experience from.

That depends on what you mean by 'dial it up', do you mean a throttle? If so then that's illegal. If it is just a 25 kph bike then you can feather the pedals and it will go up to 15 or so and above that you'll have to work for it.

Re: Show HN: Long Range E-Bike

#246

Post by Matthias247 »

jacquesm wrote: post #83
deanc wrote: post #73

I have a specialized Vado sl. You can purchase a range extender and easily do over 100km with it, in reality closer to 200k. Any reason you didn’t consider this as it’s manufacturer supported?

I never even knew about the brand. The three that I looked at were Stromer, Bosch based systems and Klever. The Bosch based system won out because it doesn't use fancy one-off stuff, there is a fairly good source for spares (batteries, motors, controllers) and it seems to be the most reliable system on the market. The Stromers are a bit faster (higher powered motors), the Klever looks clunky and I've read a ton of st…

Specialized is one of the most well-known bike brands among enthusiasts. Unfortunately also one most expensive ones.

But they have some interesting innovation going on, e.g. with the FutureShock system on rigid bikes, integration of storage in downtubes, their various suspension designs on mountainbikes, first dual-crown fork on an enduro bike, and their own e-bike system.

You can think of them as the Apple of the bike market.

Re: Show HN: Long Range E-Bike

#247

Post by gtirloni »

polote wrote: post #151
TacticalCoder wrote: post #27

We really need a terminology to differentiate better between pedal-assist only e-bikes ("pedelec") and electric motorbikes. A "bicycle" that can accelerate without the need to pedal at all is an electric motorcycle, no matter if you put pedal on it or not. I see the two as totally different things: I've tried pedal-assist e-bike and they're great. But... Although I have nothing against motorbikes I'm not cool at all…

> Although I have nothing against motorbikes I'm not cool at all with basically motorbikes getting a free pass because they're disguised as bicycles. A free pass for what ? You dont need a motor to reach 40kph on a bike, plenty of people can do it with only their legs. What we can do is limit the speed on bike lanes, but that means we could allow any vehicule on it. There is no reason a motorbike couldn't go on a bik…

> What we can do is limit the speed on bike lanes, but that means we could allow any vehicule on it.

No, we can't because of momentum. We could never allow a car or a heavy motorcycle to drive on pedestrian/bike lines even if they are at low speeds.

Re: Show HN: Long Range E-Bike

#248

Post by jacquesm »

groone wrote: post #242
jacquesm wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that with or without the weight of the battery ;)

With the battery. Normal bicycles can be as light as 8 kg when using carbon frame. Should be able to fit your battery in a 25kg bike if trying very hard.

Not this battery :) Anyway, agreed, 25 kg would be a nice upper limit to have. The bike I have weighs in at 29 kg with the original battery, now it is somewhere between 35 and 36.

Re: Show HN: Long Range E-Bike

#250

Post by allannienhuis »

TrevorJ wrote: post #240
fragmede wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And scooters, electric-scooters, and sit-down electric scooters. And electric wheelchairs, and non-electric wheelchairs and mobility assist carts with handlebars. We also have to delineate between a daydreaming cyclist who's top speed is slow, and a hard-core cyclist with a $3000+ bike that can hit 40 mph in the right conditions. Those cyclists should be banned from using the same paths as the first kind of bicyclist…

Eh, this is just extending the argument into absurdity I feel.

That's a valid and useful rhetorical technique. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reductio_ad_absurdum

Although it can be applied with a bit much snark sometimes. :)

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