231–240 of 281 posts
This looks nice ! However... "Low CPU and memory footprint (...) memory usage is under 20 MB for a Hello World program" : I am the only one who still thinks this is huge ? (-> https://tonsky.me/blog/disenchantment )
After doing web dev for years I wrote a desktop application with Qt.
It's not massively complex (but a lot more complex than a hello world) but when it's running the memory usage is very low even compared to 20mb
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How is writing something in vim faster? You can have the same bindings in many IDEs.
This thread has been specifically about responsiveness. Latency, not throughput. Also, the bit about no plugins was a little white lie. I really meant "no plugins for IDE-like functionality (language server, etc)". While many IDEs offer basic vim keybindings, I don't know any that would let me import my .vimrc wholesale and work exactly the same. I'd love an IDE that embeds neovim as the text editor. Anyway, if you d…
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Both the App Store and Microsoft Store deal with installs and updates, no need for custom wrappers. Not sure about Linux.
I have a mac laptop and windows desktop and I never use the app stores.
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20 MB is less than 0.25% of my desktop machine's memory, and 2% of a 2010-era netbook. 20 MB, while much larger than what it has to be, is tiny even by the standards of decade-old computers. RAM is cheap and plentiful. If you don't use it, its value is almost zero (the "almost" comes from OS-level caching of files and CPU-level cache misses of code).
> If you don't use it, its value is almost zero Yet if you use all of it, its value is also zero - to every other program on the same computer. Don't be a dick; Use what you need, not all you can.
The reduction of the complex trade-off between memory use, CPU, disk, development environment, ease of deployment, and the dozen other variables that go into a choice like picking what toolkit to use to "don't be a dick" is so absurdly simplistic. It's a trade-off - not a single-axis "good or bad" decision.
Moreover, 20 MB of memory usage is going to be an acceptable trade-off for the majority of HN users, who skew webdev, not embedded.
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>and each application should play nice with the system resources, so even if RAM is cheap and plentiful it doesn't automatically mean that every application should feel entitled to it. Yes, you shouldn't be a bad neighbor, but the OS will generally move things around to accommodate you as necessary. RAM is an afterthought for most of these applications for a reason. This attitude is like buying a sports car and never…
At least on Linux swap is a great tool for shuffling things you probably statistically wont use again out while retaining the ability to transparently recall them if it turns out your system guessed wrong. If you find yourself in a situation where your OS is actually shuffling things around for your system to function you will find your performance and desktop experience has gone to absolute dog shit. It's entirely l…
The baseline memory usage of Svelte NodeGUI is 20 MB. 400 instances of that can fit into 8 GB of RAM. Don't you even try to tell me that you've run 400 separate GUI applications at once.
Let me repeat it again: unused RAM is wasted RAM. This is a fact. It does nothing when neither you nor the OS is using it - and the value of the OS using a byte of RAM for caching is tiny compared to the value of you using it for an application you care about.
The above also has nothing to do with wasting RAM. If you've spent any significant amount of time developing programs for actual users (read: not programmers), you'll know that development is a complex, multi-variable tradeoff - and one of the biggest trade-offs is RAM usage for performance, so if you solely optimize for minimal RAM usage, you'll always (except for the most trivial of programs written specifically as a counterexample to this claim) end up sacrificing performance.
The wastefulness of 1 GB of RAM usage varies wildly depending on whether you're running a video editing program on a large file (hey, that's not that bad!) or a simple textual chat application. 20 MB for a graphical tool is an acceptable tradeoff in the vast majority of use-cases.
Maintainer here – Happy to answer any questions!
2. Thank you for backing up your claims about a native implementation by actually providing one, unlike your competitors Tauri and Wx who constantly lie about the topic.
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Related, my favourite thread to come out of the queer tech circles: "Almost everything on computers is perceptually slower than it was in 1983" https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/927593460642615296.html
One thing that's illuminating is go to chrome://settings/content/all and sort by "data stored" to see how much local storage websites use. Stuff like vice.com needing 100mb of space on your hard drive for who knows what purpose.
There were websites I had never heard of using hundreds of megs. Also acehardware.com for some reason using hundreds of megs.
Also Github "community" forums and Travis "community" forums (I don't use travis anyore) using hundreds of megs. Are some websites just caching the entirety of every page you look at in local storage? How rude.
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That blog post does speak to me, but 20MB for a program with a truly functional, modern UI doesn't outrage me that much. IMO there's a tradeoff: we could be writing all our programs in C, still. But it would be enormously difficult and there'd be way more bugs. On the other end of the spectrum we can be lazy, use web tech everywhere and never optimise our ballooning JS codebases. This feels like it's at least somewhe…
> IMO there's a tradeoff: we could be writing all our programs in C, still. No need for that - you could use Zig or Rust. Though both need a better GUI frameworks, but it's certainly more efficient with them.
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I tried to move from VS Code to NeoVim with NerdTree and some other plugins to make it more IDE-like. But eventually wasn't able to get the same code completion, and searching was also a bit more painful. How do you go about that? Would you mind sharing your setup? :)
Write code in vim with no/few plugins. Don't worry about getting the variable names right. Then move to your IDE to get it to compile. It's conceptually similar to sketching out the design of your code with a pen and paper or whiteboard. First write it quickly, then make it correct.
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> That isn't what my text editor is doing, though. It's doing autocomplete suggestions, linting code as I type... all sorts of things BEFORE the typed character shows up? Are you sure ? 16ms should be an absolute upper bound for a character to show up. Everything else comes after.
Before the second character is typed...