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Show HN: I wrote a book for engineers that want to become engineering managers

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Re: Show HN: I wrote a book for engineers that want to become engineering managers

#201

Post by swyx »

swebs wrote: post #189
swyx wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

probably a little of columns A and B. i guess we're all like that? (we as in underperforming devs)

Sorry, not a manager myself, so I can't help with motivation. But competence can always be gained by practicing. Try a project on your free time. Make an app with ads. The bit of extra passive income can be your carrot on a stick.

haha, thanks for the idea :) i have no problem with passive income (i've done some teaching on the side, it generates passive income, it doesnt motivate me at all) but i do wanna work on a new app.

Re: Show HN: I wrote a book for engineers that want to become engineering managers

#202

Post by jstanier »

atmosx wrote: post #160

I will keep in on your book. I've read the "Effective Manager" and the "Manager's Path" so far. The first one has some good hints here and there but it's overly verbose and at times feels like a marketing campaign. The second one, I loved and resonates with my experience so far. Congrats for getting published!

Thank you! I hope you like it.

Re: Show HN: I wrote a book for engineers that want to become engineering managers

#203

Post by jstanier »

derekja wrote: post #178
takiavosky wrote: post #173

Man you have a PhD. Is this book worth reading for someone who just have basic education?

I have a PhD. The piece of paper hangs in my bathroom so I can look at it while I shit. It was a personally fulfilling experience that taught me a lot about academic research and and is almost completely divorced from the practice of software engineering management. (and most other things.. I'd suggest never being intimidated by a PhD.) The book is written on a very approachable level, I'm enjoying it so far.

Thank you, I'm pleased you think that. My PhD was in compilers anyway. I have no formal management training. :-)

Re: Show HN: I wrote a book for engineers that want to become engineering managers

#204

Post by jstanier »

sciurus wrote: post #48
jstanier wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know if there's a way to subscribe for updates with the publisher, but if you use Twitter I'm on there as @jstanier and I give updates on how it's going. If you're not on Twitter then I can drop you an email.

I'd recommend setting up a mailing list and promoting it on your site. See the "stay in touch" section at https://dataintensive.net/ or the "sign up for newsletter" section on https://the-cloud-book.com/ for examples.

Yeah, that's a good idea. My blog has a mailing list but I did a wonderful job of making it extremely hard to find.

Re: Show HN: I wrote a book for engineers that want to become engineering managers

#205

Post by HeyLaughingBoy »

JimboOmega wrote: post #179
mixmastamyk wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve seen a few women directors/VPs of engineering, they do exist. And folks are quite used to woman managers. I tend to get talked over as well, but it’s a slightly different subject. To clarify I mean that you solve problems without being asked. As they say about actions and words.

I do have a tendency to be unconfident, to ask permission, be deferential, wait for somebody to tell me to do the thing, etc, when I could just do the thing. I tend to assume what I was going to do was wrong, especially if I get any pushback. In part because what I suggest has historically automatically been dismissed, my work and effort downplayed, etc... that doesn't seem to be a problem at my current org but I'm s…

I think some people really do need role models, so if you don't see any female engineering managers, it may be harder to envision yourself in that position.

That said, you do need to unlearn a bunch of stuff. You have to (at least pretend to) be confident, do things without permission, be self-motivating, etc. It's going to be very difficult to manage people and have them take you seriously if you can't get yourself to do those things.

I've been in a Technical Leadership position for about 10 years, with the last four having an explicit Manager title. If I were looking for someone to groom as an EM, that person would at a minimum have to show a strong level of initiative. You don't need to be "bossy" but you do need to be able to assert yourself while still considering alternate points of view.

I can point out some of the things you need to be, but I can't tell you how to get there.

Re: Show HN: I wrote a book for engineers that want to become engineering managers

#206

Post by HeyLaughingBoy »

plutonorm wrote: post #180
mixmastamyk wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The first thing is to step up and become the lead developer on your team. If you’re not being proactive folks won’t imagine it on their own. Clothes are another angle. If you look and act like a leader, soon you shall be one.

What if you're not a very good engineer, like me? But would make a good people manager?

One of the best managers I've ever known described herself that way.

She may not have been a great engineer (I'll never know), but she gave us the tools we needed to do our job, shielded us from the upper management pressure and BS and got out of our way. In return, the team shipped a ton of functionality in an impossibly short timeframe that she later confessed she never thought we'd be able to achieve.

Excel at what you're good at and the rest tends to take care of itself.

Re: Show HN: I wrote a book for engineers that want to become engineering managers

#207

Post by madrox »

me551ah wrote: post #52

IMO being a good engineering manager is quite subjective and varies across companies and even teams. The traits of a good engineer would roughly be the same across companies and would be ranked according to knowledge, work experience and quality of code etc. And since a software engineer reports to an engineering manager, expectations are also based on the views of one person. Upper management in different companies…

In my experience, what you do as an engineering manager is quite subjective, but the principles of good management are universal. Creating a mission, focusing on results, continuous improvement, growing team members...these are all things every group needs in a manager. What you do day-to-day will change wildly from job to job and also how your own skillset evolves to meet the team's needs, but it's always in the service of these goals.

Re: Show HN: I wrote a book for engineers that want to become engineering managers

#208

Post by majormajor »

plutonorm wrote: post #180
mixmastamyk wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The first thing is to step up and become the lead developer on your team. If you’re not being proactive folks won’t imagine it on their own. Clothes are another angle. If you look and act like a leader, soon you shall be one.

What if you're not a very good engineer, like me? But would make a good people manager?

Same thing, still: show it. Take on coordination/facilitation/people-facing roles in projects. Become a JIRA/bug triaging/product-person-facing master.

Re: Show HN: I wrote a book for engineers that want to become engineering managers

#209

Post by jstanier »

mixmastamyk wrote: post #101
jstanier wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you! The target audience for the newsletter was decided as "the busy exec". Not too much text, lots of gifs of functionality that we've built, etc. There's some separate newsletters we do as well - there's a fortnightly "what's going on in the backend" one, curated by our infrastructure teams that's aimed at engineers. Currently the general case newsletter goes to Engineering, Product, Product Design, and the e…

Gifs? Don’t low quality animations make it hard to read?

When they're embedded in a Google Doc, they're pretty good at getting the point across - then they can have a link to the app itself too.

Re: Show HN: I wrote a book for engineers that want to become engineering managers

#210

Post by theflyinghorse »

jredwards wrote: post #193
downerending wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to quibble, but it's a lot easier for most of us to "fire" our managers than it is for them to fire us. If your manager sucks, start interviewing.

I don't think that's a quibble. I think that's pretty fundamental. Most people don't quit their jobs, they quit their managers. And to your point, it is MUCH easier to quit than it is to fire someone. Firing someone is generally a painstaking process.

> MUCH easier to quit than it is to fire someone

What's hard about firing people? I actually don't know and would love to find out if you could share your thought

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