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Show HN: We Fixed UniFi's Slow PPPoE Performance with PPPoE Half-Bridge

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Re: Show HN: We Fixed UniFi's Slow PPPoE Performance with PPPoE Half-Bridge

#21

Post by tristor »

IneffablePigeon wrote: post #19
tristor wrote: post #17

PPPoE is pretty much only used for DSL in the US. I'm not sure about elsewhere. Xfinity and AT&T Fiber do /not/ use PPPoE. Xfinity is built on DOCSIS, and AT&T Fiber is built on XGSPON. This means neither one relies on PPPoE at the data link layer. XGSPON uses XGEM/XGTC at data link layer, DOCSIS uses MAC (same data link protocol as Ethernet). This article is making a bunch of assertions which are just patently false…

Mind telling us which assertions are false? They make no claims about pppoe adoption other than that’s what their connection uses. My fibre connection in the uk uses pppoe (2gbps)

I'm mostly replying to this line "Even in 2026, a huge number of ISPs still rely on PPPoE, including Bell Canada, AT&T Fiber, and Xfinity in the US, along with the vast majority of ISPs in Europe, Asia, and China."

Re: Show HN: We Fixed UniFi's Slow PPPoE Performance with PPPoE Half-Bridge

#22

Post by tristor »

dlgeek wrote: post #20
tristor wrote: post #17

PPPoE is pretty much only used for DSL in the US. I'm not sure about elsewhere. Xfinity and AT&T Fiber do /not/ use PPPoE. Xfinity is built on DOCSIS, and AT&T Fiber is built on XGSPON. This means neither one relies on PPPoE at the data link layer. XGSPON uses XGEM/XGTC at data link layer, DOCSIS uses MAC (same data link protocol as Ethernet). This article is making a bunch of assertions which are just patently false…

Some of AT&T's fiber acquisitions still use PPPoE including CenturyLink and Quantum's fiber offerings (acquired from Lumen).

Quantum Fiber doesn't use PPPoE, it uses IPoE w/ VLAN tagging using VLAN 201, which is a common approach for legacy GPON networks. CenturyLink Fiber does use PPPoE, but I believe only the authentication portion of PPPoE, but I have never had CenturyLink Fiber so I can't say for certain.

Re: Show HN: We Fixed UniFi's Slow PPPoE Performance with PPPoE Half-Bridge

#23

Post by tristor »

davidhariri wrote: post #7

In my specific situation I was able to use this WAS-110 to get full speed PPPoE from my fiber provider (Bell). https://pon.wiki/guides/masquerade-as-the-bce-inc-giga-hub-2...

As I noted in my other comment, AT&T Fiber doesn't actually using PPPoE, but anyway, glad to see you linked pon.wiki here. I am running XGSPON ONU stick (ONU on SFP) with the community firmware for my AT&T Fiber connection, getting native 5gbit throughput without the AT&T device in the path. pon.wiki is an amazing resource.

Re: Show HN: We Fixed UniFi's Slow PPPoE Performance with PPPoE Half-Bridge

#24

Post by preisschild »

tristor wrote: post #17

PPPoE is pretty much only used for DSL in the US. I'm not sure about elsewhere. Xfinity and AT&T Fiber do /not/ use PPPoE. Xfinity is built on DOCSIS, and AT&T Fiber is built on XGSPON. This means neither one relies on PPPoE at the data link layer. XGSPON uses XGEM/XGTC at data link layer, DOCSIS uses MAC (same data link protocol as Ethernet). This article is making a bunch of assertions which are just patently false…

VDSL2 is using PPPoE here in europe often. Havent seen it used on PON based internet connections though

Re: Show HN: We Fixed UniFi's Slow PPPoE Performance with PPPoE Half-Bridge

#25

Post by Arubis »

sarabveer wrote: post #11

> Even in 2026, a huge number of ISPs still rely on PPPoE, including Bell Canada, AT&T Fiber, and Xfinity in the US, along with the vast majority of ISPs in Europe, Asia, and China. Comcast (Xfinity) does not use PPPoE.

An approximate, if imperfect, predictor of PPPoE usage is "did this organization previously deliver packets over twisted pair, especially DSL?". Xfinity/Comcast historically (and currently) delivered packets over coaxial cable -> no PPPoE. All the telcos delivered over DSL -> mostly PPPoE.

Re: Show HN: We Fixed UniFi's Slow PPPoE Performance with PPPoE Half-Bridge

#26

Post by toast0 »

tristor wrote: post #22
dlgeek wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of AT&T's fiber acquisitions still use PPPoE including CenturyLink and Quantum's fiber offerings (acquired from Lumen).

Quantum Fiber doesn't use PPPoE, it uses IPoE w/ VLAN tagging using VLAN 201, which is a common approach for legacy GPON networks. CenturyLink Fiber does use PPPoE, but I believe only the authentication portion of PPPoE, but I have never had CenturyLink Fiber so I can't say for certain.

I don't know how 'only authentication' from PPPoE would work... If you do PPPoE auth, then you can DHCP? That would be a pretty weird config to setup.

I know some CenturyLink fiber defaults to PPPoE, but you can ask for IPoE instead.

Re: Show HN: We Fixed UniFi's Slow PPPoE Performance with PPPoE Half-Bridge

#27

Post by montjoy »

tristor wrote: post #22
dlgeek wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of AT&T's fiber acquisitions still use PPPoE including CenturyLink and Quantum's fiber offerings (acquired from Lumen).

Quantum Fiber doesn't use PPPoE, it uses IPoE w/ VLAN tagging using VLAN 201, which is a common approach for legacy GPON networks. CenturyLink Fiber does use PPPoE, but I believe only the authentication portion of PPPoE, but I have never had CenturyLink Fiber so I can't say for certain.

I have Quantum and a UCG fiber. IIRC you only have to turn off vlan tagging on the ONT, and then set DHCP and the vlan tag on the UCG. If you try to keep the vlan tag on ONT you will get horrendous latency. The ISP still shows as CenturyLink.

Re: Show HN: We Fixed UniFi's Slow PPPoE Performance with PPPoE Half-Bridge

#28

Post by throwaway67743 »

There is really so much failure in this post: crappy vendor, misunderstanding how PPP actually works (it requires no addressing at all), using "half bridge" (idiot term) instead of just using it properly. I swear people are even less informed than 20 years ago, it's very sad.

Re: Show HN: We Fixed UniFi's Slow PPPoE Performance with PPPoE Half-Bridge

#29

Post by dlgeek »

tristor wrote: post #22
dlgeek wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of AT&T's fiber acquisitions still use PPPoE including CenturyLink and Quantum's fiber offerings (acquired from Lumen).

Quantum Fiber doesn't use PPPoE, it uses IPoE w/ VLAN tagging using VLAN 201, which is a common approach for legacy GPON networks. CenturyLink Fiber does use PPPoE, but I believe only the authentication portion of PPPoE, but I have never had CenturyLink Fiber so I can't say for certain.

You're right about Quantum. I just went and checked my router config. (I switched from CL to Q about 6 months ago).

CenturyLink did use a full PPPoE stack though.

Re: Show HN: We Fixed UniFi's Slow PPPoE Performance with PPPoE Half-Bridge

#30

Post by crest »

chaz6 wrote: post #18

A lot of people dunk on PPPoE, but it does have one redeeming feature: failover is a lot easier and faster compared to IPoE. With IPoE you often rely on vendor-proprietary mechanisms. The closest thing to a common standard is packet-triggered sessions. Normally, BNG's set up sessions using DHCP but you can rig it to do a RADIUS request for a non-DHCP packet without a known session. In this case, it will send the sour…

What's wrong with using BFD for IP over Ethernet? You can put whatever control plane you want on top from simple static route priorities to full blown eBGP and everything inbetween.
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