Show HN: Avoid editing while writing your first draft • Hacker News Board

Re: Show HN: Avoid editing while writing your first draft

#21

Post by nickjj » Mon, Nov 11, 2019, 6:22 PM UTC

This might be an unpopular opinion but I always edit while writing my first draft. This is how I've written 250+ technical blog posts and over a million words worth of course notes.

I basically write a couple of sentences or paragraphs, stop, review, reword things if needed, change things around and move on. Then at the very end I'll give it all a final reordering / fixing until I'm happy with it.

I feel like I can't progress to the next chunk of an article until the prior section is 95% edited because what I write next depends on what was previously written.

Does anyone else work like that?

Re: Show HN: Avoid editing while writing your first draft

#22

Post by mortivore » Mon, Nov 11, 2019, 6:24 PM UTC

nickjj wrote: post #21

This might be an unpopular opinion but I always edit while writing my first draft. This is how I've written 250+ technical blog posts and over a million words worth of course notes. I basically write a couple of sentences or paragraphs, stop, review, reword things if needed, change things around and move on. Then at the very end I'll give it all a final reordering / fixing until I'm happy with it. I feel like I can't…

Yeah, I work like that. I don't like writing, and haven't done a lot of it professionally, but this has always been my process when I've had to write.

Re: Show HN: Avoid editing while writing your first draft

#23

Post by pier25 » Mon, Nov 11, 2019, 6:26 PM UTC

nickjj wrote: post #21

This might be an unpopular opinion but I always edit while writing my first draft. This is how I've written 250+ technical blog posts and over a million words worth of course notes. I basically write a couple of sentences or paragraphs, stop, review, reword things if needed, change things around and move on. Then at the very end I'll give it all a final reordering / fixing until I'm happy with it. I feel like I can't…

I work like that too for small stuff but I guess the advice of not editing while drafting is more geared towards longer forms (books, scripts, etc).

Re: Show HN: Avoid editing while writing your first draft

#24

Post by kazinator » Mon, Nov 11, 2019, 6:27 PM UTC

If you don't do some editing while writing a first draft, but instead defer your intent to make those corrections, you will fail to execute some of those corrections later.

The virtue of editing on a computer is that you can easily correct as you go. If you don't think that's a good idea, you might as well go back to a typewriter or handwriting.

Re: Show HN: Avoid editing while writing your first draft

#25

Post by tajd » Mon, Nov 11, 2019, 6:30 PM UTC

nickjj wrote: post #21

This might be an unpopular opinion but I always edit while writing my first draft. This is how I've written 250+ technical blog posts and over a million words worth of course notes. I basically write a couple of sentences or paragraphs, stop, review, reword things if needed, change things around and move on. Then at the very end I'll give it all a final reordering / fixing until I'm happy with it. I feel like I can't…

Me too. I find that I use the writing process to identify what I'm really trying to communicate. I see that it is important to get the text on the page, but I can't seem to move on until I can't reduce the writing before losing meaning.

A book people might find interesting is Joe Moran’s "First You Write a Sentence: The Elements of Reading, Writing … and Life". He examines writing from the ground up. I found it a really wonderful book to read. Each sentence in it is great.

Re: Show HN: Avoid editing while writing your first draft

#26

Post by john-radio » Mon, Nov 11, 2019, 6:32 PM UTC

nickjj wrote: post #21

This might be an unpopular opinion but I always edit while writing my first draft. This is how I've written 250+ technical blog posts and over a million words worth of course notes. I basically write a couple of sentences or paragraphs, stop, review, reword things if needed, change things around and move on. Then at the very end I'll give it all a final reordering / fixing until I'm happy with it. I feel like I can't…

The "never edit while drafting" advice comes from the creative writing community. It might be of limited use in cases like technical writing, where you already might have a solid idea what the final product should look like before you start. Most people find that trying to write a novel and edit it at the same time is like baking cookies one by one.

Re: Show HN: Avoid editing while writing your first draft

#27

Post by thdrdt » Mon, Nov 11, 2019, 6:33 PM UTC

Masters in all kinds of areas have in common that they start with the big picture and then start refining level by level. But they can keep themselves from refining details that are smaller than the current level.

I think this works for writing as well.

Personally I also use this in programming. When I was young I directly dove into the details but that just doesn't work. Now I'm more like a painter. First big strokes and taking smaller brushes as I move along.

Re: Show HN: Avoid editing while writing your first draft

#28

Post by munmaek » Mon, Nov 11, 2019, 6:37 PM UTC

I do something like this from time to time, just with pen and paper. I often have thoughts for blog posts, and I'll write out as much as I can in a dedicated notebook. After ~2-6 days, I'll look at it again with fresh eyes and type up a first rough draft, doing edits, writing more, and rearranging everything to be more cohesive. Again, after 2-6 days I'll take another look and polish the draft.

Generally by that point I find the post is ready to go, but sometimes I go through three or four edits on pieces I'm not sure about. Feedback is also good- I typically ask a friend or my brother to see what they think.

Planes and trains are great for this; I find that I get a lot of writing done while traveling. Even on the subway, sometimes I just type up thoughts into the Notes app, and then pull it up on my computer later.

Re: Show HN: Avoid editing while writing your first draft

#29

Post by amilein7minutes » Mon, Nov 11, 2019, 6:45 PM UTC

nickjj wrote: post #21

This might be an unpopular opinion but I always edit while writing my first draft. This is how I've written 250+ technical blog posts and over a million words worth of course notes. I basically write a couple of sentences or paragraphs, stop, review, reword things if needed, change things around and move on. Then at the very end I'll give it all a final reordering / fixing until I'm happy with it. I feel like I can't…

I completely agree with you. When it comes to academic writing, the content transforms itself into a more coherent entity as I write. Oftentimes the big picture seems laughably inadequate and even inaccurate when I look at the final product, so much so that writing itself seems like research and thinking beforehand, almost redundant.

Hamming agrees in his famous speech (see the Q&A section on this page - https://www.cs.virginia.edu/~robins/YouAndYourResearch.html) that 50% of the time is just spent writing/presenting research.

Re: Show HN: Avoid editing while writing your first draft

#30

Post by tyre » Mon, Nov 11, 2019, 6:46 PM UTC

thdrdt wrote: post #27

Masters in all kinds of areas have in common that they start with the big picture and then start refining level by level. But they can keep themselves from refining details that are smaller than the current level. I think this works for writing as well. Personally I also use this in programming. When I was young I directly dove into the details but that just doesn't work. Now I'm more like a painter. First big stroke…

> I think this works for writing as well.

Many many many fiction writers have said they don't plan things out this way. A vast majority of writers I've read interviews of do not plan things out this way. Salman Rushdie, Zadie Smith, Jeffrey Eugenides, Stephen King, and George Saunders are a few I've seen talk about this in person.

Reported pieces are sometimes different, but even then in narrative non-fiction that narrative can evolve along the way. For technical pieces it could be the same.

The reason it works is that it is far easier to futz around with the master plan/outline than it is to get your ass in a chair and write. Also, in fiction certainly, the characters reveal themselves as they go. You can't build more than a pastiche of a human with an outline.