As a temporary workaround for AdBlock (and for Firefox since it's not supported by HTTPSB), here's EasyList stripped out of all its CSS rules.
It obviously lets some banners slip through, but most of them are still blocked.
Show HN: Where Adblock+ injects 20K CSS rules, HTTPSB injects one
171–180 of 183 posts
Re: Show HN: Where Adblock+ injects 20K CSS rules, HTTPSB injects one
#172Earlier quoted context omitted.
A website displays on _my_ computer. I should have more control over that "space" than a "public space", for sure. There's nothing wrong with wanting complete control of how my computer is being used. If the business model of the advertisers requires that they trust that my computer displays their ads then I see it as their fault for misplacing their trust.
> A website displays on _my_ computer. I should have more control over that "space" than a "public space", for sure. There's nothing wrong with wanting complete control of how my computer is being used. Who cares if it's _your_ computer? It's _their_ product or service you're using, which is offered to you under well-defined terms of use. You're free to not use it if you don't agree with the terms of use. Let's assum…
The position that an owner of a computer should be obligated to cede control of their computer to third-parties seems more ethically dubious to me than the position that they should not. I am certainly proud to make the argument that the owner of a computer should control its operation.
I would argue that terms-of-service "agreements" which assume I will cede control of my computer to a third-party are immoral. I find it offensive that anyone would argue that it's alright for others to tell me what I can do with my computer. I wish more people would take a stand against attempts to control how owners of computers use their devices. We might not have gotten ugly legislative constructs (like the DMCA in the US) if people had cared more about their rights.
The "essence" of my argument is this: Private owners get to control their computers (at least right now). It is a false reality to think things are different.
I don't think your analogies about unlawful detention of persons, theft of scarce physical goods, and some kind of victim-blaming rape accusation follow at all. I certainly can't formulate how to respond to these non sequiturs. Code executing inside a computer has very little to do with kidnapping, theft, or rape. I certainly don't see any of them as even remotely equivalent or analogous.
I might have made an argument about the "morality" of skipping commercials using digital video recorders (DVRs), which seems a lot closer to analogizing altering how a web site displays on my computer. Television producers are learning that owners of DVRs skip commercials and, rather than (for the most part) making arguments about taking away the rights of owners of DVRs, are moving to other business models (like product placement).
Rather than assuming my computer will display their Customers' ads (or doing odious things like trying to get laws passed to make private ownership of general purpose computers illegal) I'd rather see website operators move to new business models. If that means that some "free" services disappear then so be it. If a service can't finance itself by having its users be its Customers then I'd argue there's probably a pretty good chance we're better off without it.
(I do find it exceedingly amusing that you admit to using AdBlock yet make the argument you do. I haven't ever used any advertisement blocking software. I simply eschew services that I find inundate me with advertising, or just "look around" the ads when a service is compelling enough to use.)
Re: Show HN: Where Adblock+ injects 20K CSS rules, HTTPSB injects one
#173Earlier quoted context omitted.
The website as it displays on your computer using your computer memory and screen and CPU is your space, not the website's. So what Banksy says is even more true. To use your analogy, your computer is your planet . If websites don't like that their ads can't get past your customs officers, that's their problem.
But I'm voluntarily visiting the place! Of course I'm using my resources doing that. What's next: let the cooking magazine pay your electricity bill, because you decided to try out their recipe? Let the cinema pay for your glasses? If your memory, screen or CPU is precious, don't visit that site. You know the deal and you have a free will. Use it.
>But I'm voluntarily visiting the place! Of course I'm using my resources doing that.
You could say this about the in person advertising that Banksy describes too.
Re: Show HN: Where Adblock+ injects 20K CSS rules, HTTPSB injects one
#174Earlier quoted context omitted.
You are calling HTTPSB an alternative for Adblock Plus. One of the major use cases of Adblock Plus is effectively "Fire and Forget" mode - enable it and then don't worry about it. You are saying HTTPSB does not support this use case. As such, I don't see why you can call it an alternative to Adblock Plus.
That's like saying that walking isn't an alternative to driving because there's no wheels. It's different, has a superset of functionality, and a different interface. It isn't a fork of ABP.
It does not have a superset of functionality.
Adblock Plus / Edge has a "Fire and Forget" mode, as I described in my grandparent comment. HTTPSB does not. Hence, HTTPSB's functionality is not a superset of Adblock Plus/Edge's functionality.
Re: Show HN: Where Adblock+ injects 20K CSS rules, HTTPSB injects one
#175Earlier quoted context omitted.
The website as it displays on your computer using your computer memory and screen and CPU is your space, not the website's. So what Banksy says is even more true. To use your analogy, your computer is your planet . If websites don't like that their ads can't get past your customs officers, that's their problem.
But I'm voluntarily visiting the place! Of course I'm using my resources doing that. What's next: let the cooking magazine pay your electricity bill, because you decided to try out their recipe? Let the cinema pay for your glasses? If your memory, screen or CPU is precious, don't visit that site. You know the deal and you have a free will. Use it.
And the site is voluntarily serving you their content.
Your cooking magazine argument is specious: you're not requesting the website pay your bills. The analog would be a magazine which assaults you with inserts, pop-ups, fragrance scents, a 90:10 advertising-to-copy ratio (and most of the copy is product placements), and charges you $10+ for the privilege.
Oh yeah: that's what they do. Which is why I don't buy magazines (with very rare exceptions).
Re: Show HN: Where Adblock+ injects 20K CSS rules, HTTPSB injects one
#176Okay, so how can we get the ABP people to do likewise? I'd love to see a reaction from them explaining either why they can't do it, why it wouldn't help, or when they're planning on doing it...
Wladimir Palant(ABP dev) gives a short response here:
https://adblockplus.org/blog/on-the-adblock-plus-memory-cons...
Re: Show HN: Where Adblock+ injects 20K CSS rules, HTTPSB injects one
#177Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's like saying that walking isn't an alternative to driving because there's no wheels. It's different, has a superset of functionality, and a different interface. It isn't a fork of ABP.
Walking from New York to California to transport 15 tons of perishable cargo VS driving a truck with a refrigeration unit. Your analogy fails.
Your analogy fails too. I use a manual javascript blocking add-on (noscript) instead of an automatic blacklisting one and its not a deal-breaker. Minor effort required.
Re: Show HN: Where Adblock+ injects 20K CSS rules, HTTPSB injects one
#178Given that advertising pays for a lot of the services we all use, the use of Adblock and similar programs constitutes defection in game theory terms - the more people who do it, the worse off we all are - which means even if you choose to do it yourself (I personally don't), it is against your interests to encourage other people to do it. Also, given that computing is one of very few areas of technology in which our…
We are living in a world where resource depletion is a serious concern on the health and well-being of humanity. Advertisement encourages resource depletion. Therefore we shouldn't support advertisement at all.
Re: Show HN: Where Adblock+ injects 20K CSS rules, HTTPSB injects one
#179Earlier quoted context omitted.
Banksy says it best: People are taking the piss out of you everyday. They butt into your life, take a cheap shot at you and then disappear. They leer at you from tall buildings and make you feel small. They make flippant comments from buses that imply you’re not sexy enough and that all the fun is happening somewhere else. They are on TV making your girlfriend feel inadequate. They have access to the most sophisticat…
You've entirely misunderstood both Banksy's quote and the conversation on this thread. He's talking about the co-opting of _public spaces_ for advertisement; Walking down the street is an activity that anyone has a right to do with no contingencies, and he sees being "forced" to see advertising as an intrusion on that activity. Whether or not you agree with him, that's certainly an internally consistent view of thing…
What if I click an unknown link that sends me to a popup page that I didn't consent to going to? They would be getting benefit at my expense.
Re: Show HN: Where Adblock+ injects 20K CSS rules, HTTPSB injects one
#180Earlier quoted context omitted.
The salient part is "public space". Websites aren't public space.
A website displays on _my_ computer. I should have more control over that "space" than a "public space", for sure. There's nothing wrong with wanting complete control of how my computer is being used. If the business model of the advertisers requires that they trust that my computer displays their ads then I see it as their fault for misplacing their trust.
That's like saying "I should have a say of what you put in your house, because it's my eyes that see it when I come over". If you don't like my house, don't come over. If you don't like a website, don't visit it. It's not yours, any more than you can dictate what goes on a TV channel just because your TV shows it.