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Show HN: Container Desktop – Podman Desktop Companion

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Re: Show HN: Container Desktop – Podman Desktop Companion

#141

Post by forrestthewoods »

mook wrote: post #131
forrestthewoods wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The number of things that can't be shipped is extremely small. And I don't think that Docker is a silver bullet for Wayland vs X11 issues? Although I'm not sure about the fine details as I don't have a ton of experience there. Shouldn't you be using an abstraction that can automatically support which ever is available? I tend to ship code that needs to run on Linux + macOS + Windows + Android. So Docker is a total no…

It's the same thing everywhere — there are some dependencies you can't ship. On Linux, you can't ship the window server (because you need to share it with all of the other apps also running). On mac, you can't ship Core Foundation. On Windows, kernel32.dll etc. I assume Android is similar — I haven't tried figuring out what a purely static app on Android would be, since I think the bootstrap is Dalvik… It's literally…

Let me rephrase. If a dependency can be bundled then it should be bundled.

The "Linux Way" is to depend on a bunch of random garbage pooped by lord knows bullshit script into one of several global search paths. This is bad, stupid, and wrong. Programs should include as many of their dependencies as is possible.

The number of dependencies that a program can not deploy and must assume are provided by the system are extremely minimal and special case. It's a short and static list.

In general no script or program should add libraries into the global search paths. On Windows user programs do not add random crap to System32. On Linux the existence of /usr/lib is an abomination that should not exist.

Is that better? I'm fairly certain you understand what I'm trying to say.

Re: Show HN: Container Desktop – Podman Desktop Companion

#142

Post by justinclift »

1oooqooq wrote: post #125
justinclift wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does it use the same "containers are really just running in a Linux VM" approach as Docker Desktop on macOS?

unless you run osx on a Linux kernel, it will always be so. not a personal attack on you, but it blows my mind how clueless the current generation of developers become after the docker phase.

> unless you run osx on a Linux kernel, it will always be so

Linux is not the only OS that has container like things. FreeBSD had jails years earlier, Solaris had something else which I don't remember any more, and for all I know macOS may have their own native equivalent as well.

Bear in mind that Apple introduced an official hypervisor framework a few releases ago, so they could be doing something similar for containers. It wouldn't be a bad idea. :)

Re: Show HN: Container Desktop – Podman Desktop Companion

#144

Post by tanduv »

1oooqooq wrote: post #128
shepherdjerred wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMO if Docker is important to you then Orbstack is worth it. The debug shell feature alone makes it better than any alternative, and hopefully that subscription money is put towards more unique features. https://docs.orbstack.dev/features/debug

if i understood that page, debug shell is... "exec" with a nicer .bashprofile and injected text editor binary???

It's installing additional packages which may not have been included in your base image.

> Debug Shell works by injecting a debugging environment using: > NixOS for a large package collection, and flexibility with filesystem paths

https://orbstack.dev/blog/debug-shell?utm_source=relnotes

Re: Show HN: Container Desktop – Podman Desktop Companion

#145

Post by alexchamberlain »

sverhagen wrote: post #115
istoica wrote: post #45

Kubernetes is planned - my devops wants me to add it badly! Author note - Most of you guys here are power users, for whom UI is a visual poem that you need or not. This is not a commercial project, it is not following any business goals. But this does not mean concessions to quality, it does try to offer minimal resource usage everywhere, easy experience, good UI/UX. It explains all it does behind the scenes if you e…

I don't live my life entirely on the command line either, but GUIs for Docker are just an interesting niche to me, for which I just don't understand what the ven diagram is between people that want Docker containers running locally, know that that's what they want, and know how it all works, but then don't want to do the small handful of commands at the prompt needed to get it running...

I use Docker Desktop on both my macbooks, despite shunning IDEs in favour of a decent text editor and the command line. I use it for 2 reasons: to manage the Linux VM, and to twiddle the occasional setting. For running the containers themselves, or running `system prune` when everything gets cluttered up, I use the CLI.

Re: Show HN: Container Desktop – Podman Desktop Companion

#146

Post by osigurdson »

istoica wrote: post #45

Kubernetes is planned - my devops wants me to add it badly! Author note - Most of you guys here are power users, for whom UI is a visual poem that you need or not. This is not a commercial project, it is not following any business goals. But this does not mean concessions to quality, it does try to offer minimal resource usage everywhere, easy experience, good UI/UX. It explains all it does behind the scenes if you e…

>> Kubernetes is planned - my devops wants me to add it badly!

Do you mean the Podman "Kubernetes like" functionality (e.g. podman play kube..) or Kubernetes itself?

Re: Show HN: Container Desktop – Podman Desktop Companion

#147

Post by osigurdson »

sverhagen wrote: post #115
istoica wrote: post #45

Kubernetes is planned - my devops wants me to add it badly! Author note - Most of you guys here are power users, for whom UI is a visual poem that you need or not. This is not a commercial project, it is not following any business goals. But this does not mean concessions to quality, it does try to offer minimal resource usage everywhere, easy experience, good UI/UX. It explains all it does behind the scenes if you e…

I don't live my life entirely on the command line either, but GUIs for Docker are just an interesting niche to me, for which I just don't understand what the ven diagram is between people that want Docker containers running locally, know that that's what they want, and know how it all works, but then don't want to do the small handful of commands at the prompt needed to get it running...

I agree on the docker / podman, but for Kubernetes, Lens is is really useful. It isn't a substitute for knowing the command line but can be much quicker.

Re: Show HN: Container Desktop – Podman Desktop Companion

#148

Post by ahoka »

sverhagen wrote: post #115
istoica wrote: post #45

Kubernetes is planned - my devops wants me to add it badly! Author note - Most of you guys here are power users, for whom UI is a visual poem that you need or not. This is not a commercial project, it is not following any business goals. But this does not mean concessions to quality, it does try to offer minimal resource usage everywhere, easy experience, good UI/UX. It explains all it does behind the scenes if you e…

I don't live my life entirely on the command line either, but GUIs for Docker are just an interesting niche to me, for which I just don't understand what the ven diagram is between people that want Docker containers running locally, know that that's what they want, and know how it all works, but then don't want to do the small handful of commands at the prompt needed to get it running...

Your false assumption is that most of its users know what is Docker and how it works.

Re: Show HN: Container Desktop – Podman Desktop Companion

#149

Post by ahoka »

brianpan wrote: post #135
1oooqooq wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

unless you run osx on a Linux kernel, it will always be so. not a personal attack on you, but it blows my mind how clueless the current generation of developers become after the docker phase.

I don't understand this comment on any level. Containers will only ever be on a linux kernel or VM? Never natively on ANY other OS? Only Linux containers exist? Developers were more clueful about containers before Docker made them wildly popular?

“Only Linux containers exist?“

In practice, yes.

Re: Show HN: Container Desktop – Podman Desktop Companion

#150

Post by fragmede »

1oooqooq wrote: post #125
justinclift wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does it use the same "containers are really just running in a Linux VM" approach as Docker Desktop on macOS?

unless you run osx on a Linux kernel, it will always be so. not a personal attack on you, but it blows my mind how clueless the current generation of developers become after the docker phase.

personal attack or not, you could have just left that last bit off and had a good comment.

There's always been a mythos of a true developer. Here's a rant from 1983 about how real programmers don't use Pascal. https://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/real.programmers.html

Kids these days...

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