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Show HN: NanoClaw – “Clawdbot” in 500 lines of TS with Apple container isolation

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Re: Show HN: NanoClaw – “Clawdbot” in 500 lines of TS with Apple container isolation

#101

Post by charcircuit »

jofzar wrote: post #65
redfloatplane wrote: post #13

I think these days if I’m going to be actively promoting code I’ve created (with Claude, no shade for that), I’ll make sure to write the documentation, or at the very least the readme, by hand. The smell of LLM from the docs of any project puts me off even when I like the idea of the project itself, as in this case. It’s hard to describe why - maybe it feels like if you care enough to promote it, you should care to t…

I 100% agree, reading very obviously ai written blogs and "product pages"/readme's has turned into a real ick for me. Just something that screams "I don't care about my product/readme page, why should you". To be clear, no issue with using AI to write the actual program/whatever it is. It's just the readme/product page which super turns me off even trying/looking into it.

Why do you think people do not care about something if they AI generated it? I care about many things I've generated.

Re: Show HN: NanoClaw – “Clawdbot” in 500 lines of TS with Apple container isolation

#103

Post by vasco »

nialse wrote: post #89
jimminyx wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OP here. Appreciate your perspective but I don't really accept the framing, which feels like it's implying that I've been caught out for writing and coding with AI. I don't make any attempt to hide it. Nearly every commit message says "Co-Authored-By: Claude Opus 4.5". You correctly pointed out that there were some AI smells in the writing, so I removed them, just like I correct typos, and the writing is now better.…

”I don't care deeply about this code. It's not a masterpiece. It's functional code that is very useful to me.” - AI software engineering in a nutshell. Leaving the human artisan era of code behind. Function over form. Substance over style. Getting stuff done.

The art department is that way, we do engineering here. Faster is better.

Re: Show HN: NanoClaw – “Clawdbot” in 500 lines of TS with Apple container isolation

#105

Post by codeforclout »

nialse wrote: post #89
jimminyx wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OP here. Appreciate your perspective but I don't really accept the framing, which feels like it's implying that I've been caught out for writing and coding with AI. I don't make any attempt to hide it. Nearly every commit message says "Co-Authored-By: Claude Opus 4.5". You correctly pointed out that there were some AI smells in the writing, so I removed them, just like I correct typos, and the writing is now better.…

”I don't care deeply about this code. It's not a masterpiece. It's functional code that is very useful to me.” - AI software engineering in a nutshell. Leaving the human artisan era of code behind. Function over form. Substance over style. Getting stuff done.

Was about to comment precisely this, that line does not inspire any confidence.

And it reminds me of a comment I saw in a thread 2 days ago. One about how RAPIDLY ITERATIVE the environment is now. There area lot of weekend projects being made over the knee of a robot nowadays and then instantly shared. Even OpenClaw is to a great extent, an example of that at its current age. Which comes in contrast to the length of time it used to take to get these small projects off the ground in the past. And also in contrast with how much code gets abandoned before and after "public release.

I'm looking at AI evangelists and I know they're largely correct about AI. I also look at what the heck they built, and either they're selling me something AI related, or have a bunch of defunct one-shot babies or mostly tools so limited in scope they server only themselves with it. We used to have a filter for these things. Salesmen always sold promises, so, no change there, just the buzzwords. But the cloutchasers? Those were way smaller in number. People building the "thing" so the "thing" exists mostly stopped before we ever heard of the "thing", because, turns out, caring about the "thing" does not actually translate to the motivation to getting it done. Or Maintain it.

What we have now is a reverse survivorship bias.

OOP stating they don't care about the state of their code during their public release, means I must assume they're a Cloutchaser. Either they don't care because they know they can do better which means they shared something that isn't their best, so their motivation with the comment is to highlight the idea. They just wanted to be first. Clout. Or they don't exactly concern with if they can as they just don't care about code in general and just want the product, be it good or be it not. They believe in the idea enough they want to ensure it exists, regardless of what's in the pudding. Which means to me, they also don't care to understand what's in the ingredient list. Which means they aren't best to maintain it. And that latter is the kind that, before the LLM slop was a concept in our minds, were precisely ones among the people who would give up half way through Making The "Thing".

See you in 16 weeks OP. I'll eat my shoe then.

Re: Show HN: NanoClaw – “Clawdbot” in 500 lines of TS with Apple container isolation

#106

Post by _zoltan_ »

nialse wrote: post #89
jimminyx wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OP here. Appreciate your perspective but I don't really accept the framing, which feels like it's implying that I've been caught out for writing and coding with AI. I don't make any attempt to hide it. Nearly every commit message says "Co-Authored-By: Claude Opus 4.5". You correctly pointed out that there were some AI smells in the writing, so I removed them, just like I correct typos, and the writing is now better.…

”I don't care deeply about this code. It's not a masterpiece. It's functional code that is very useful to me.” - AI software engineering in a nutshell. Leaving the human artisan era of code behind. Function over form. Substance over style. Getting stuff done.

There should never have been an "artisan era". We use computers to solve problems. You should have always getting stuff done instead of bikeshedding over nitty-gritty details, like when in the office people have been spending weeks on optimizing code... just to have the exact same output, exact same time, but now "nicer".

You get paid to get stuff done, period.

Re: Show HN: NanoClaw – “Clawdbot” in 500 lines of TS with Apple container isolation

#107

Post by charcircuit »

popcorncowboy wrote: post #33

> running it scares the crap out of me A hundred times this. It's fine until it isn't. And jacking these Claws into shared conversation spaces is quite literally pushing the afterburners to max on simonw's lethal trifecta. A lot of people are going to get burned hard by this. Every blackhat is eyes-on this right now - we're literally giving a drunk robot the keys to everything.

It turns out the lethal trifecta is not so lethal. Should a business avoid hiring employees since technically employees can steal from the cash register. The lethal trifecta is about binary security. Either the data can be taken or it can't. This may be overly cautious. It may be possible that hiring an employee has a positive expected value when when you account for the possibility of one stealing from the cash register.

Re: Show HN: NanoClaw – “Clawdbot” in 500 lines of TS with Apple container isolation

#108

Post by figassis »

vasco wrote: post #103
nialse wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

”I don't care deeply about this code. It's not a masterpiece. It's functional code that is very useful to me.” - AI software engineering in a nutshell. Leaving the human artisan era of code behind. Function over form. Substance over style. Getting stuff done.

The art department is that way, we do engineering here. Faster is better.

What part of faster is better means engineering to you? Non engineers will prefer you get there faster, but however you get there, better is better.

Re: Show HN: NanoClaw – “Clawdbot” in 500 lines of TS with Apple container isolation

#109

Post by muyuu »

redfloatplane wrote: post #13

I think these days if I’m going to be actively promoting code I’ve created (with Claude, no shade for that), I’ll make sure to write the documentation, or at the very least the readme, by hand. The smell of LLM from the docs of any project puts me off even when I like the idea of the project itself, as in this case. It’s hard to describe why - maybe it feels like if you care enough to promote it, you should care to t…

the main reason I'd want a person to write or at least curate readmes is because models have, at least for the time being, this tendency to make confident and plausible-sounding claims that are completely false (hallucination applied to claims on the stuff they just made)

so long as this is commonplace I'd be extremely sceptical of anything with some LLM-style readmes and docs

the caveats to this is that LLMs can be trained to fool people with human-sounding and imperfectly written readmes, and that although humans can quickly oversee that things compile and seem to produce the expected outputs, there's deeper stuff like security issues and subtle userspace-breaking changes

track-record is going to see its importance redoubled

Re: Show HN: NanoClaw – “Clawdbot” in 500 lines of TS with Apple container isolation

#110

Post by chaostheory »

For anyone else worried about running openclaw, in my case I just bought openclaw its Mac mini and I gave openclaw its own accounts including GitHub. It makes many of the security concerns moot. Of course, I could go further and give openclaw its own internet access as well.
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