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Show HN: I built a virtual tabletop for playing Dungeons and Dragons

diceright.com

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Re: Show HN: I built a virtual tabletop for playing Dungeons and Dragons

#11

Post by manbash »

treyd wrote: post #7

I always thought it was bizarre that there's no serious selfhostable FOSS virtual tabletop software [1]. The overlap between the two communities is very large and passionate. Foundry is selfhostable but it's a clunky proprietary node.js application and there's a ton of janky UI issues. Roll20 is far worse. I presume that this Diceright project is better since it's actually using a canvas. But why doesn't someone just…

Criticism for Foundry aside, it's an extordinary effort to implement a mature self-hosted alternative, especially as FOSS implies it's going to be a side project for most if not all of its developers.

Foundry's upside is that it's extensible (modules), which increases traction and nurtures a community.

Most of the FOSS attempts will probably die if they won't take that approach (extensibility that is).

Re: Show HN: I built a virtual tabletop for playing Dungeons and Dragons

#13

Post by YakiSauce »

manbash wrote: post #8

This looks like a really awesome project. But, I can't understand if this is a subscription service or I can simply self-host. I don't want to sign up without having that information first.

Great question. So far, I've just been doing this myself as a side project so I haven't spent much time thinking through how I would or could monetize it (open to suggestions on that). That being said, I think eventually, it would probably have to be some kind of subscription, if there's any real interest in it. It's not really built to be self hosted right now unfortunately.

Re: Show HN: I built a virtual tabletop for playing Dungeons and Dragons

#14

Post by delecti »

jbaczuk wrote: post #9

I "played" D&D once with some people who play quite a bit, and was confused. Maybe I was expecting more clear rules of how to "win"? It seemed like it was more of a "choose you're own adventure" story rather than a game since the dungeon master is able to change the rules as you go and pretty much decide whether or not you are "successful" with whatever goals are established at the beginning. Is that accurate? In the…

There are usually fairly clear rules for executing the steps in a combat (what actions are "legal" on a character's turn), but the characters' goals in a campaign are entirely subjective. The overall flow of a campaign is collaborative storytelling: the DM sets the scene, but the characters decide their actions at any given point along the way, and having clearly delineated "go here next" is often viewed as a sign the DM is being too controlling.

Think of Lord of the Rings (both because it's a good example to make my point, and because it's the source of a lot of the inspiration for D&D). All the fellowship are independently given a vague mission to go to Rivendell. They then decide, in Rivendell, to embark on a quest to take the ring to Mordor. Consequences split them up on separate missions along the way; in a D&D game, splitting the party is poor etiquette, but it's a good example of how your immediate next steps can change in unpredictable ways. The overall journey of any given character is decided by that character based on their circumstances and personal values.

Re: Show HN: I built a virtual tabletop for playing Dungeons and Dragons

#15

Post by miah_ »

This is neat, but so far every thing like this that we've used for our D&D game has been overkill.

What we do currently:

Take a map from a PDF, load in Paint program (paint.net/photoshop/gimp/whatever), create a layer of BLACK over it. Share the screen. The DM slowly erases BLACK as we move and discover the map.

This way, the players cannot see the map. The DM can see the map. The players get to slowly discover the map.

We do dice rolls and type their output into chat. Our player sheets are player sheets, and we scanned and sent pdf's to DM. We keep group inventory via chat. Everything else is basically overkill, because it requires the DM to redesign maps via some web app and DM's already don't have time.

*edit

to be clear. we've looked into them all. the solution above is what we've now been doing for _years_ on our D&D game. Goddamn erake (our BBG).

Re: Show HN: I built a virtual tabletop for playing Dungeons and Dragons

#16

Post by tnecniv »

jbaczuk wrote: post #9

I "played" D&D once with some people who play quite a bit, and was confused. Maybe I was expecting more clear rules of how to "win"? It seemed like it was more of a "choose you're own adventure" story rather than a game since the dungeon master is able to change the rules as you go and pretty much decide whether or not you are "successful" with whatever goals are established at the beginning. Is that accurate? In the…

Correct. It is much more free form than other games (and even more free form RPGs exist).

Every group has their own style. The DM might be very strict or loose with his reading of the rules. Players could be more or less into the role playing aspect (do you have to do voices and talk in character or not). Ultimately, your character can do whatever the DM allows them to do. That might seem “unfair” but the DM is not your opponent trying to beat you, they’re telling a story with you.

There’s not really a win condition. Some groups play campaign modules which are pre-written stories the DM interprets for your group. Some make it up on the fly like an improv comedy group or nerd jazz.

Re: Show HN: I built a virtual tabletop for playing Dungeons and Dragons

#17

Post by wincy »

jbaczuk wrote: post #9

I "played" D&D once with some people who play quite a bit, and was confused. Maybe I was expecting more clear rules of how to "win"? It seemed like it was more of a "choose you're own adventure" story rather than a game since the dungeon master is able to change the rules as you go and pretty much decide whether or not you are "successful" with whatever goals are established at the beginning. Is that accurate? In the…

I play D&D because I’m hyper competitive and D&D doesn’t trip that “competing against other people” that makes me short circuit (and often spend a ton of money, Magic The Gathering especially got me so I won’t play that at all anymore) while still being that same kind of fun. It’s a way to hang out with my friends and tell a group story that’s fun to talk about and reminisce about “the time the evil demon lord tried to fly away and the Druid called upon the power of nature and hit him with a lightning bolt”. Or “that time the bard sold his soul to a devil”.

I don’t really remember specific combat we remember the fun and stories we told, even if they’re pretty lame compared to just reading a book. But they’re our unique story.

And if I put a ton of time into D&D that looks like “3D printing terrain” or “painting miniatures” (which are cool little statues so have some inherent aesthetic value) which are also fun hobbies (in my opinion) vs “accruing lots of thin pieces of cardboard” or “number goes up on screen”.

Re: Show HN: I built a virtual tabletop for playing Dungeons and Dragons

#18

Post by delecti »

treyd wrote: post #7

I always thought it was bizarre that there's no serious selfhostable FOSS virtual tabletop software [1]. The overlap between the two communities is very large and passionate. Foundry is selfhostable but it's a clunky proprietary node.js application and there's a ton of janky UI issues. Roll20 is far worse. I presume that this Diceright project is better since it's actually using a canvas. But why doesn't someone just…

I think Owlbear Rodeo fits the bill, somewhat.

They recently released a more feature-rich cloud-based V2, but simultaneously released the source and self-hostable images for their V1.

Edit: I meant to add this initially but just forgot: https://blog.owlbear.rodeo/owlbear-rodeo-legacy-edition/

Re: Show HN: I built a virtual tabletop for playing Dungeons and Dragons

#19

Post by treyd »

manbash wrote: post #11
treyd wrote: post #7

I always thought it was bizarre that there's no serious selfhostable FOSS virtual tabletop software [1]. The overlap between the two communities is very large and passionate. Foundry is selfhostable but it's a clunky proprietary node.js application and there's a ton of janky UI issues. Roll20 is far worse. I presume that this Diceright project is better since it's actually using a canvas. But why doesn't someone just…

Criticism for Foundry aside, it's an extordinary effort to implement a mature self-hosted alternative, especially as FOSS implies it's going to be a side project for most if not all of its developers. Foundry's upside is that it's extensible (modules), which increases traction and nurtures a community. Most of the FOSS attempts will probably die if they won't take that approach (extensibility that is).

Yeah that's how I see how it would work. Just build a framework for the players to interact in according to the basic mechanics of tabletop games and then expose a rich module API and hand it off to users. If you're clever about it I could imagine you could machine-translate the art asset formats made for Foundry, or design it to use it directly.

Re: Show HN: I built a virtual tabletop for playing Dungeons and Dragons

#20

Post by Arch485 »

jbaczuk wrote: post #9

I "played" D&D once with some people who play quite a bit, and was confused. Maybe I was expecting more clear rules of how to "win"? It seemed like it was more of a "choose you're own adventure" story rather than a game since the dungeon master is able to change the rules as you go and pretty much decide whether or not you are "successful" with whatever goals are established at the beginning. Is that accurate? In the…

That's not entirely accurate. D&D _is_ a choose your own adventure, and there's not necessarily a way to "win"^1. However, the DM is not technically supposed to just "change the rules as you go" to decide whether or not something is successful (that said, everyone has their own house rules etc. etc.).

^1: Your DM can define an end goal/win condition for your campaign, though.

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