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Ask HN: Questions about a Microsoft Offer

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Ask HN: Questions about a Microsoft Offer

#1

Post by zippzom »

So a couple weeks ago I got a linkedin message from a microsoft recruiter, one thing led to another, and I just got a "Congratulations" email today. I've been working at a startup since I graduated a couple years ago, and I really like it. The startup is doing well, and I make 120k cash and my options are valued at about ~35k per year (we just raised a Series B).

I haven't interviewed anywhere since starting this job, and I wasn't really planning on leaving until this microsoft interview fell into my lap. I'm still waiting on the details of the offer, since they make you pick a team prior to discussing compensation etc.

My questions are:

1. Do you think Microsoft's reputation on my resume is similar to a Facebook / Google? E.g., do you think it will help me get more senior positions at companies after my tenure there?

2. Is Microsoft's compensation on par with FB/Google? My college roommate just started at FB and makes at 250k a year all in (stocks + signing bonus + $$), is that a reasonable ask at microsoft as well?

3. How would you value startup options that were pre Series A after a startup has raised a Series B? Most signs at my current company are positive, although there are certainly some scaling issues.

4. My second year annual review / raise is upcoming at work. Is it considered poor form to bring this microsoft offer to the table and ask for more money / whatever else I might want (e.g. more vacation, more options)?

5. Can I negotiate this Microsoft offer to its max without offers from other big companies? I have outstanding interview offers from Google and some other companies that I've been pushing back since I wanted to prep first. I have a sense of how much friends of mine make at these companies, but do I need an actual offer to push Microsoft's up? Even if I'll walk away if they don't match those theoretical offers?

Sorry this is slightly disjointed, this was a quick process and I'm still organizing my thoughts.

Re: Ask HN: Questions about a Microsoft Offer

#2

Post by jiveturkey »

1. Yes but more important is what you personally are working on, not what company you're at. As a new grad at a bigco, you are unlikely to have a significant position, so purely as a resume builder, the "rep" isn't going to be useful. That said, bigco experience is very valuable, even if you switch back to startups.

2. Yes and Yes

3. To 4 decimals: $0.0000. That's not being snide.

4. No

5. Yes/No/Yes. All companies know what other companies are paying for typical engineers. If you are a particular standout in a particular specialization (eg AI) then you'd have an edge by getting a competing offer, but otherwise not.

You didn't state where you are and where the job is, but I take it both are bay area.

> I wasn't really planning on leaving

Then you may be putting the cart in front of the horse. If you like your job, and like the company, are learning things, why change? I hope you realize it's completely different working for a bigco than a startup.

Re: Ask HN: Questions about a Microsoft Offer

#3

Post by Zelmor »

Don't compare to what your friends are making, compare to what you need to make to live well and save up for early retirement. If you'd earn double but would also spend double in a year from now, you're not in great shape financially. Look into your financial spending history, and make up your mind.

Anyway, all three companies are doing evil in the world, as far as I'm concerned, so I'd rather stay with the startup. Then again, I'm just your average freetard open source / freedom advocate.

Re: Ask HN: Questions about a Microsoft Offer

#4

Post by zippzom »

Zelmor wrote: post #3

Don't compare to what your friends are making, compare to what you need to make to live well and save up for early retirement. If you'd earn double but would also spend double in a year from now, you're not in great shape financially. Look into your financial spending history, and make up your mind. Anyway, all three companies are doing evil in the world, as far as I'm concerned, so I'd rather stay with the startup.…

All the teams I'd be working on at microsoft are working on at least partially open source products now. But I do have some ethical qualms about the big corporations, although I've essentially setting those aside for the early part of my career until I've established myself more.

As far as money goes, I was just using that as a reference to what could be expected at a big company like Microsoft. I already make more $$ than I could spend, and my COL wouldn't change with job. Extra money is just more financial freedom for my future

Re: Ask HN: Questions about a Microsoft Offer

#5

Post by zippzom »

jiveturkey wrote: post #2

1. Yes but more important is what you personally are working on, not what company you're at. As a new grad at a bigco, you are unlikely to have a significant position, so purely as a resume builder, the "rep" isn't going to be useful. That said, bigco experience is very valuable, even if you switch back to startups. 2. Yes and Yes 3. To 4 decimals: $0.0000. That's not being snide. 4. No 5. Yes/No/Yes. All companies k…

Thanks! I definitely feel like I'm learning stuff, but I also could probably learn at a big company as well. Most of the engineers at my current company are very inexperienced, for most of them this is the only company they've ever worked for, so all of my learning is very self directed.

Current job is in the Bay, but Microsoft would be in Washington (which I prefer, and is essentially a free 5% raise on top of whatever else due to taxes).

At what point do you start to value options above that? Uber isn't public yet but I think it's safe to assume their options are worth something.

Re: Ask HN: Questions about a Microsoft Offer

#6

Post by jason_slack »

I'd like to offer this advice:

1. Besides salary and options..would you like to work at Microsoft?

2. Do you have a family or are planning one? Does Microsoft seem like a place you can have a work - life balance? If your significant other wants to go on a date night, can you go or is it likely work will demand your attention?

3. What does your gut tell you? Sometimes above all else you have a feeling about things. I listen to mine.

4. If you walk into Microsoft, day 1, and they say "hey, we have possible bugs in this string library, please read the bug reports and fix the bugs"....are you down? Of are you gonna be like: "I left startup xxx for this.....". Usually newbies get some grunt work to prove themselves.

Re: Ask HN: Questions about a Microsoft Offer

#7

Post by alexeldeib »

zippzom wrote: post #5
jiveturkey wrote: post #2

1. Yes but more important is what you personally are working on, not what company you're at. As a new grad at a bigco, you are unlikely to have a significant position, so purely as a resume builder, the "rep" isn't going to be useful. That said, bigco experience is very valuable, even if you switch back to startups. 2. Yes and Yes 3. To 4 decimals: $0.0000. That's not being snide. 4. No 5. Yes/No/Yes. All companies k…

Thanks! I definitely feel like I'm learning stuff, but I also could probably learn at a big company as well. Most of the engineers at my current company are very inexperienced, for most of them this is the only company they've ever worked for, so all of my learning is very self directed. Current job is in the Bay, but Microsoft would be in Washington (which I prefer, and is essentially a free 5% raise on top of whate…

Disclaimer: MS employee.

You say 5% raise excepting taxes. Friendly reminder Washington state has no state income tax, as this impacts consideration of Seattle income vs Bay Area.

Re: Ask HN: Questions about a Microsoft Offer

#8

Post by DoreenMichele »

alexeldeib wrote: post #7
zippzom wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks! I definitely feel like I'm learning stuff, but I also could probably learn at a big company as well. Most of the engineers at my current company are very inexperienced, for most of them this is the only company they've ever worked for, so all of my learning is very self directed. Current job is in the Bay, but Microsoft would be in Washington (which I prefer, and is essentially a free 5% raise on top of whate…

Disclaimer: MS employee. You say 5% raise excepting taxes. Friendly reminder Washington state has no state income tax, as this impacts consideration of Seattle income vs Bay Area.

I read it as saying "Because there is no state tax in Washington, it is a de facto 5% raise, all other things being equal."

Re: Ask HN: Questions about a Microsoft Offer

#9

Post by alexeldeib »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #8
alexeldeib wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disclaimer: MS employee. You say 5% raise excepting taxes. Friendly reminder Washington state has no state income tax, as this impacts consideration of Seattle income vs Bay Area.

I read it as saying "Because there is no state tax in Washington, it is a de facto 5% raise, all other things being equal."

I assume so as well. OP seemed incredulous of the relative $ amount between Bay Area BigCo and Seattle BigCo and that they lacked parity. I don’t have any context for the startup and its pay scale, but figured the clarity may help.

E: on a third reading, OP may have meant 5% raise in addition to dollars gained due to tax differences.

Re: Ask HN: Questions about a Microsoft Offer

#10

Post by zippzom »

alexeldeib wrote: post #9
DoreenMichele wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I read it as saying "Because there is no state tax in Washington, it is a de facto 5% raise, all other things being equal."

I assume so as well. OP seemed incredulous of the relative $ amount between Bay Area BigCo and Seattle BigCo and that they lacked parity. I don’t have any context for the startup and its pay scale, but figured the clarity may help. E: on a third reading, OP may have meant 5% raise in addition to dollars gained due to tax differences.

Sorry I assumed the pay would be equivalent between the regions for the same job at the same company. The 5% raise would just be a result of no state income tax.
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