Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Ask HN: Co-founder mom died, and his depression is effecting the business

news.ycombinator.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

1–10 of 17 posts

Ask HN: Co-founder mom died, and his depression is effecting the business

#1

Post by icevalley »

Hi guys,

We're a team of 3. One of the guys lost their mom earlier this year, and bouts of grief and depression have taken hold of him.

His productivity and work quality has nosedived. He's uncooperative, non-communicative, and is often absent.

I've tried to understand what he's going through, and I've talked about it with him. I've suggested he take some time off (which he doesn't want to do).

He's adamant he wants to continue, and he's seeking help from a counselor.

This has been going on for ~4 months, and it's really taken a toll on our business. The 3rd co-founder and I find it demotivating and frustrating when he disappears.

I feel as if the best thing for the business is to let go of him, but it's a shitty thing to do. Moreover – I feel as if his depression would worsen if he lost his place in the team.

I'm not an experienced manager.

Is there anybody on here who has successfully dealt with depressed employees/co-founders?

Edit: spelling

Re: Ask HN: Co-founder mom died, and his depression is effecting the business

#2

Post by kafkaesq »

Is there anybody on here who has successfully dealt with depressed employees/co-founders?

Yes, I know of one well-known company which gave one of its core team members an unlimited leave of absence (with a believable promise that they'd be welcome to come back any time in the next 2 years). The key aspect here is that this was a small-ish, (then) family-run company -- and in many ways, the team was like family, too. Also, this was well before the current hyper-accelerated "My startup's growth plan über alles" ethos that we have today -- so even aside from the family-run aspect, people at least did generally have some perspective on the human side of things (unlike today).

I feel as if the best thing for the business is to let go of him, but it's a shitty thing to do.

Absolutely. Definitely don't just fire the guy. (Aside from being a shitty thing to do -- I'm assuming it's abundantly clear already that there's a significant chance that could backfire in ways that could hurt the company far beyond the current loss of productivity).

But (absent an actual, forced leave of absence) it may be a good idea to ply him with a significant amount of paid leave (4+ months), with a suggestion that he put aside any idea of working full-time for quite a bit longer than that -- plus a statement that he's not only welcome, but very strongly encouraged to re-apply at any time after 6 (given that it's basically too complicated legally to outright promise someone a position will be available for them in the future, given the way business conditions usually go -- which I'm sure he can understand, in his current condition).

Things happen in life, and sometimes you just have to do the right thing.

Re: Ask HN: Co-founder mom died, and his depression is effecting the business

#3

Post by supernormal »

Define the separation between your personal and professional life clearly. It's not a shitty thing to do.

I don't have any recommendations for which action to take next. But do try to speak to him honestly and open up to each other as deeply as you can not only to find out what action you should take next, but to come to a decision together.

Re: Ask HN: Co-founder mom died, and his depression is effecting the business

#4

Post by asimjalis »

"The 3rd co-founder and I find it demotivating and frustrating when he disappears."

This seems like a bigger issue to me than the one in your subject.

His disappearance should not affect the validity of your vision and the validity of the opportunity.

If his disappearance is demotivating this is a sign that your motivation needs work.

If you fire him something else will replace him as the conditional hook that will trigger the demotivation.

You can fire him or keep him. But your reason should not be that his presence is demotivating.

Or rather if this is your reason you will find yourself demotivated anyway, regardless of what you do.

Re: Ask HN: Co-founder mom died, and his depression is effecting the business

#5

Post by kohanz »

Have you already had an open and honest discussion with him outlining the above? Presumably you have evidence of his decreased productivity so that it's not a subjective point of view. What is his response when you tell him that he's been absent and not productive when present? Maybe he doesn't want time off, but he needs to come up with a plan with you guys that has him returning to regular productivity.

Re: Ask HN: Co-founder mom died, and his depression is effecting the business

#6

Post by help505 »

If you haven't already talked to him about this, I would take down this post. It seems very likely that he, or someone he knows, could read this and connect the dots.

At the very least, you should minimize information related to the time-frame and size of your team.

Re: Ask HN: Co-founder mom died, and his depression is effecting the business

#7

Post by macmaharaja »

I'm not an experienced manager or anyone to give advice thereof, but I have experienced what your co-founder is currently going through. Last Year in January, my father passed away and the next 8-9 months were miserable for me. Sleeplessness, anxiety and depression were almost feeding to each other and took a toll on me. I could hardly sleep for an hour at night for consecutive weeks and months at a time.

I would start getting palpitations followed by dangerously high blood pressure. Touch wood, nothing major happened to me and I'm back to normal life.

If you guys can cooperate with him and give him the time, I'm sure he will come back to leading a normal productive life.

Like someone suggested, give him an indefinite leave of absence and have him work with therapists and recover fully.

Re: Ask HN: Co-founder mom died, and his depression is effecting the business

#10

Post by hluska »

YuriNiyazov wrote: post #8

I think that next time you talk to him, instead of "suggesting" that he take some time off, you have to clarify that it is not a suggestion, but a business partner request, and a "no" will not be looked upon kindly.

With the limited information we have available, this advice is, at best, extremely dangerous. We don't know:

- the cap table.

- the depressed founder's role in the company.

- the make up of the rest of the team.

- the articles of incorporation.

Without this information, there is no way that you can know if a hard sell, like you propose, will backfire.

Business decisions, particularly those involving major personal losses and ensuing mental illness, never happen in a vacuum. Advising a hard sell is extremely irresponsible.

Post reply on HN