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Ask HN: How can we solve the loneliness epidemic?

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Re: Ask HN: How can we solve the loneliness epidemic?

#961

Post by sebg »

gulugawa wrote: post #493
sebg wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Helping people like you are seems like an amazing start. Maybe try to get a pyramid structure going where you teach people to help other people and then they teach people and then it’s a movement? But at all times a low level of effort so there is no pressure other than just holding up a sign or a marker. I’ve found the hardest thing is breaking the ice and the sign / marker normalises a low stakes interaction where…

I think teaching people so that they can teach others is a necessity. I've fond that the most effective meetups are the ones where people have a shared sense of ownership, which includes being welcoming to people who are new. One board game group I am a part of ran for 2 years without an official host for this reason.

100% agree! Teaching others to teach helps broaden their perspective/ world as well. Everyone wins

Re: Ask HN: How can we solve the loneliness epidemic?

#962

Post by perrygeo »

For me, the loneliest period of my life was when I was socially active but hanging out with people that I didn't really like or respect. Don't neglect spiritual and mental health as a strong component of loneliness. It's not always about dragging your body from one event to another to maximize the number of people in your life. You have to make sure your mind, body and spirit are present and aligned.

Re: Ask HN: How can we solve the loneliness epidemic?

#963

Post by lucketone »

mullingitover wrote: post #131

> So they sit on social media all day when they're not at work or school. How can we solve this? The naive solution is to place blame on the people who are influenced by the most advanced behavior modification schemes ever devised by humans. Kinda like how the plastic producers will push recycling, knowing they can shift blame for the pollution away from their production of the pollution, because people love blaming.…

Giving over the agency to corporations is no beneficial over all.

Re: Ask HN: How can we solve the loneliness epidemic?

#964

Post by avensec »

Dilettante_ wrote: post #903
avensec wrote: post #259

Many answers address the question of "how to build community." I like those responses! I also want to contribute to the discussion with an emotional intelligence response. The theory is that "loneliness" can be a symptom of underlying internal factors. While it is true that loneliness can arise from a lack of community, people, and related factors, for some people, the problem stems from not knowing how to be alone.…

Could you give some pointers re: Internal sense of self-worth, especially as relating to attachment theory? How did you get better?

Thanks for asking! Until I learned to be alone without feeling abandoned by myself, no amount of connection could make me feel less lonely. Here is a rough outline of topics and how I feel they relate.

In attachment terms, loneliness can be a signal that we haven't yet internalized a stable sense of safety and worth. I wasn't missing others, I was missing an internal relationship with myself.

I was anxious even with others, because safety, worth, and regulation were outsourced to my relationships. I needed others to constantly help me feel those things. That was me externalizing my self worth.

I was avoidant with myself, because the connection with myself felt unsafe or unfamiliar. I leaned on things, status, money, in order to avoid looking deep within my heart. In the end, I had to do a lot of internal work. I had to learn that I matter even when no one is affirming me. Leaning on those was self-abandonment in disguise. I would think, "If only I just had a little more knowledge I could solve this." We generally don't solve heart problems with our head.

Loneliness eased when I stopped trying to get my sense of self from the external world. I had to become someone that I could be with. Someone I didn't need to escape from.

How I accomplished it was not a short journey, but in summary it looked like:

1) Knowing my past, tolerating the discomfort, and sitting in it without judgement. I did this with a therapist.

2) Having a safe individual who always nurtured me, and taught me how to be OK with my big feelings. This was with an emotional intelligence coach. I felt the loneliness ease greatly once I could affirm myself.

3) Now that I had the knowledge to know my heart and my worth, I could then create connections outside of myself. I see this like, having the book knowledge, but now being able to learn how true it was experientially. This led to meeting my best friend and partner in this life. Having someone close to co-regulate, when I need support, and providing that in return, has been the final piece of the puzzle.

I firmly believe that most people need someone to co-regulate with. We can't white-knuckle our way to knowing ourselves better, but boy did I try!

Thanks again, and best of luck on your journey if you are on it :).

Re: Ask HN: How can we solve the loneliness epidemic?

#965

Post by d--b »

publicdebates wrote: post #935
d--b wrote: post #783

It looks like every comment here is suggesting that lonely people should do something to feel less lonely. But that's not how you stop an epidemic. The epidemic is a systemic things, and you don't solve systemic things by giving advice to individuals. You solve systemic things by changing the whole culture. and you change the whole culture by large scale initiative. That said, I have no idea about what to do!

I firmly disagree. I do agree that the advice being given for individuals is very misguided. It's like preaching to a nearly empty church about why more people should come to church. You're only going to reach the ones who are already there. But in this case, systemic solutions don't exist outside of (a) individuals taking action, and then (b) that action having a real impact, and then (c) the individuals, actions, a…

Sure it always starts with an individual or a group of individuals, but what you describe is some sort of virality. Like a counter-epidemic if you will. It’s one way of getting changes in culture, which relies a lot on lucky timing. Like the Tee-totaler movement that lead to the prohibition in the US.

I think these events are extraordinarily rare. Civil rights is another one. These only happen when the bad situation is totally unbearable. Like huge wildfires happen when there is forest overgrowth.

Otherwise you need some sort of top down approach. if you want people to actually recycle their trash, fine them if they don’t. if you want people to stop dying on the roads, severely punish DUI and speeding. If you want people to have more children, reduce their taxes if they have some, etc.

Now fixing loneliness is complicated for sure. My opinion is that a grassroot movement is not going to succeed, cause the current situation is not that unsustainable, so people won’t take it in their own hands.

Re: Ask HN: How can we solve the loneliness epidemic?

#966

Post by ryandrake »

publicdebates wrote: post #923
ggfdh wrote: post #912

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The inability of your friends to have non-political conversations can be a big part of isolation. I follow the “no politics, no religion” rule when I go out and it’s served me well. You can have political/religious conversations with people who disagree but often it feels like walking in a mine field.

On one hand, I always want to keep an open mind about religion and politics, and I'm always interested in hearing what others are passionate about, even if it's in those topics. That's how I've learned so much of what I have. If everyone followed the rule of avoiding these topics, I wonder how many people would never hear an opposing opinion, maybe even a more beneficial one, to the one they've grown up with. I think…

> That said, the moment you disagree with someone on one of these topics, some people will definitely fly into a small rage, or instantly cut off contact with you, or even slander you to others, or some mix of these.

I think this is what changed. I remember being a kid in the 80s, and when my parents had friends over, someone would inevitably bring up Reagan or something, but the discussion would always be polite and graceful, and then people would move on to something else. So many people seem to be incapable of this today. Politics comes up and suddenly the friend group is cut in half and daughters don't talk to fathers anymore. It's wild.

Re: Ask HN: How can we solve the loneliness epidemic?

#967

Post by tsoukase »

Number one in managing loneliness: stand on your own legs. Realise that true happiness comes from inside not from outside, find meaning in just being alive.

Second is family, parents until 30's and then your own. Wife, kids will always be there, either on Wednesday night or on Christmas. You will give no f for others.

Third long time friends in decreasing time scale: high school, college/uni, work.

Fourth you reach out any club you find, from mushroom lovers to blind date lovers.

Re: Ask HN: How can we solve the loneliness epidemic?

#968

Post by Dilettante_ »

avensec wrote: post #964
Dilettante_ wrote: post #903

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you give some pointers re: Internal sense of self-worth, especially as relating to attachment theory? How did you get better?

Thanks for asking! Until I learned to be alone without feeling abandoned by myself, no amount of connection could make me feel less lonely. Here is a rough outline of topics and how I feel they relate. In attachment terms, loneliness can be a signal that we haven't yet internalized a stable sense of safety and worth. I wasn't missing others, I was missing an internal relationship with myself. I was anxious even with…

Thank you for giving such a comprehensive answer, this is very helpful.

Re: Ask HN: How can we solve the loneliness epidemic?

#969

Post by maerF0x0 »

scottious wrote: post #940
maerF0x0 wrote: post #917

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A large number of these things did not exist when we had a lot less isolation, and a stronger social connection. You dont need public transportation if you have a strong community proximal to you. You dont need government childcare if You have teenagers (inexpensive babysitters) or family members to do it. Nature takes the path of least resistance. I would suggestion this is reductionistic. People take the past of hi…

Parents need reliable childcare. A teenager or aging parents can't fill this gap reliably. I need somebody to watch the kids most days from 8 until 4. A high schooler won't be able to do this. My in-laws who live 1.5 hours away and have mobility issues (plus their own lives) can't always do that. I agree we need strong community in close proximity, but still people need to travel to destinations a few miles from thei…

> can't fill this gap reliably

Except they did... for centuries ?? How can we claim that relying on community and a network of people is unreliable when it was the defacto solution for as long as we've existed?

Re: Ask HN: How can we solve the loneliness epidemic?

#970

Post by Archer6621 »

SwtCyber wrote: post #723
neilk wrote: post #438

You have to be the one who creates things to do. Really, that’s it. You want to play D&D together, you host and DM. You want to just hang out, you reach out and propose what you’re doing. You want more purposeful and meaningful time, join a volunteer group you vibe with. Even if it’s meeting for coffee. You have to be the one who reaches out. You have to do it on a regular cadence. If, like me, you don’t have little…

"Be the organizer" assumes a certain baseline of energy, confidence, and emotional resilience. For people who are already lonely, depressed, neurodivergent, burned out, or socially anxious, that constant reaching out + rejection tax can be genuinely exhausting, not just uncomfortable

I agree. I also don't think forcing yourself to be an organizer is necessarily a solution to fixing the loneliness, as it also just requires a certain passion. In my experience, some people love organizing things, others just really hate it. I am in that last camp, after having organized quite a lot. For me, simply participating with things that are organized by others has done me much more good. Of course, that still requires being in a state of mind where you are able to take initiative with signing up for such group activities.
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