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Ask HN: A 19 year old, what should I do?

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Re: Ask HN: A 19 year old, what should I do?

#91

Post by icu »

Hi Coolsbz,

Firstly a degree is good for getting a job, showing that you can stick to something for a number of years, and gaining a good network of friends who may provide future opportunities for you.

Notice I didn't say anything about learning.

What you learn at university will be obsolete.

About career development, I think it's important to think that your actual job isn't your job, but your 'job' is to get an ever better job. Don't expect your employers will care about your career, they are going to try and squeeze you for all that you're worth. Always be looking for new job opportunities even if you have a job.

If you think you will get a good job after the end of your degree then it may be worth grinding through it. If not you might be better to secure a job before dropping out and then keep looking for ever better and better jobs.

Good luck!

Re: Ask HN: A 19 year old, what should I do?

#92

Post by jakobe »

coolsebz wrote: post #74
jakobe wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it out of your reach? Because they are too expensive? If you want to study at a better college, look for professors in your field, find someone that does something interesting, and ask them if they will take you as a student. If you are good, some institutions will actually pay you for studying there. This is easiest if you already have at least a bachelors degree, and want to go to grad school. At least in Eu…

I didn't know I could talk to professors for this, but it sounds interesting! Thanks, I'm going to try this!

This is probably more important towards the end of your undergraduate studies.

At least in Austria it's quite common to receive a stipend for your masters' thesis (in science/engineering). It's not always enough to fully cover living expenses, but it sure helps a lot (eg. I got 400€ a month while working on my master's thesis).

After that, PhD positions are almost all paid normal wages.

Re: Ask HN: A 19 year old, what should I do?

#93

Post by re1ser »

patio11 wrote: post #12

I'm not sure where you're physically located, but if you were a young cousin of mine on either the US or Japanese sides of the family, I'd tell you get the degree. If you feel that college is too easy mode for you, feel free to take more difficult or eclectic courses, or throw yourself into extracurriculars. (It's a great time to learn a foreign language.) Why get the degree? 1) Because there is no circumstance where…

I'm in similar situation, and from neighbor country, Serbia. 24 years old, and with 2 classes left to finish college. I've started with freelancing 2 years ago while I still had tons of classes left, then job just went upwards. At the moment I work for a monthly salary that would cover atleast 8 months of living here, but this reflected negatively on my motivation and time for last extra push to finish remaining 2 classes. What I can tell you is to not give up, as majority of other people mentioned here, college degree may feel not-needed in your CS career, but it doesnt really hurt to have one. I actually renewed my college year today, and plan to finish it by July, while working fulltime. I also recommend you to not focus fully on college, IMHO, better use your time to develop your skills on whatever you want to do in future and look at college as a place to make connections with other people and try to finish it with minimal effort involved in classes that won't help you at all in your professional path.

Re: Ask HN: A 19 year old, what should I do?

#94

Post by tezza »

coolsebz wrote: post #49
JoelOtter wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm at an engineering-focused uni here in the UK (studying computing), and there are a LOT of Romanian guys in my year - all of them very, very good. The level of mathematics you guys get taught at high school far exceeds that of the UK, let alone the US. You sound like the kind of person who probably sailed through high school and likely has great exam results from there. Combined with the fact that you've got tonne…

I'm actually considering that! Where exactly do you study? I feel like around here they teach us too much math, but no practical stuff and I would like to give it a shot and study abroad

Scotland heavily subsidised their courses for EU peeps such as yourself.

Edinburgh University Computer Science: £1820 PA... now that is a steal

http://www.docs.sasg.ed.ac.uk/fees/undergraduate_2014-2015.c...

Re: Ask HN: A 19 year old, what should I do?

#95

Post by h4pless »

So you already know what you're doing when it comes to code, you know how to learn the things you don't know on your own, and the classes offered by your school don't interest you: don't study computer science.

The one thing I would suggest is that before you drop out of school, test the waters in other fields. Take psychology and sociology to learn how the minds of individuals and the community at large work. Take micro and macro economics and learn how the economy functions and the pro's and con's of different public policy. Enjoy the outdoors? Learn about physics, meteorology, bio-mechanics, geology, biology, organic chemistry....

I mean I could list off different things you could pursue all day but the the point is, college offers you a unique opportunity to try out and get basic understandings of a lot of different things.

Sometimes I think, "Shit, if I would have just skipped school and gone straight into working on software development, I'd probably be making $150k+ a year right now, probably would have a few of my business ideas up and running, wouldn't have had to deal with the debt..." But the thing is, if I could go back and choose not to attend college or to drop out, there is no way in hell I would.

College is one of those things that has a proportional rate of return for the effort you put in. So if programming in college isn't your cup of tea because you are already a superstar, I would suggest you test the waters in other fields and see if you can learn something you find interesting while you're there. If, on the other hand, you are sure that you only care about working as a programmer I would suggest you stop wasting your time and money on something that has no value to you. But I'm sure if you look hard enough, you will find subjects and teachers that inspire you and will come out of the experience a much more well rounded thinker.

Re: Ask HN: A 19 year old, what should I do?

#96

Post by ThePawnBreak »

coolsebz wrote: post #86
ThePawnBreak wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey! I'am also from Romania. Where do you study?

Hey! :D Timisoara, UVT

I'm at ACS Bucharest, in my second year. It's pretty bad here as well.

I suggest you finish your degree (nevermind the grades, just get a 5), and spend your free time learning what you're interested in. The good thing is that there are a lot of good internships available, especially in Bucharest (Adobe, Intel, Ubisoft etc.). You can find them on stagiipebune.ro (check out VMware in Bulgaria, too).

Re: Ask HN: A 19 year old, what should I do?

#97

Post by ThePawnBreak »

pyduan wrote: post #75
coolsebz wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for your response! I'm living in Eastern Europe, Romania; not exactly a tech hub, which is why the college level is so low :/ Most of what I've learned is from free available resources (books, lectures, you name it) Thanks for the points on why I should get the degree, they make sense!

Here are two other arguments in favor for college on top of patio11's: 1) While you may be worried about the depth of the content in your field, be aware that college is also a great way to acquire breadth : this is the best way to be exposed to ideas you wouldn't have encountered before, and I'd encourage you to take courses outside of your field. Economics, philosophy, or political science come to mind as topics th…

In Romania, you don't choose your classes, the classes choose you. The way it works is that you are admitted directly at a faculty, not at a university, and just take the classes they decide you should. So if you're a CS major and want to take a class on economy, tough luck.

Re: Ask HN: A 19 year old, what should I do?

#98

Post by PolemicThoughts »

Hey. I was in a similar boat. I am US-based, so I'm not sure how much relevance my story has to you. I turn 19 in two months.

I've been programming for leisure for years. I got my first job programming in 10th grade, and loved it. When I graduated a year later, I went to a semester of college.

It's not that college was easy-- it was difficult for me. I just didn't care as much for the subjects I was being tought, and didn't try to succeed. It was time for me to pay for the second semester. I managed to pay for the first one with liquid, but that wasn't going to happen again.

My parents strongly discouraged not going to college, although they are biased in that matter; my mother has dual masters degrees, and my father has a Ph.D, and their degrees are very important to their career pathes.

The job I was at wasn't enough to sustain myself. I was underpaid, the commute was long, and upper management didn't agree on the value that I was adding to the company, despite direct management having a conflicting opinion. Anecdote: one of my friends that worked at a nearby grocery store who's job consisted of literally putting fruit on shelves was making more than me, which made me a bit bitter.

I couldn't find anything locally, since I lived in a remote, rural US town, so I started applying to various surrounding cities. The first job I applied to, I got an offer, and I took it. It was fun, a great learning experience, and I even got a promotion to mid-level developer. I've since left for a job at a similar position at a startup, mostly for fun. It has turned out to be much harder than I expected, but that's OK- challenges are fun.

I have felt incredibly valued by my coworkers and management. I feel successful, and I have no reason to regret my career choices.

My advice to you is to keep pushing forward. I feel like there isn't a HN consensus on this topic, but it is my opinion that there are few programming jobs that require a college education and do not provide an "or similar experience" clause, particularly within US-based startups. The majority of my employers haven't cared for a degree; they just want their employees to be good.[1]

Also, check out online freelancing sites such as oDesk and Elance. It's easy to get started, and I only saw one or two listings that required a degree in the three months I spent on oDesk. One of my contracts turned into the full time position that I have now.

[1] I may be susceptible to survivorship bias, as any employer that would agree to hire someone without a degree obviously wouldn't care for the degree.

Re: Ask HN: A 19 year old, what should I do?

#99

Post by Loque »

Experience isn't just with your profession. May sound odd but I have learnt a lot that has changed the way I am with code and business from completely un-related happenings.

I might suggest, that you will be fine, whatever path you pick, it's mostly about making the most out of the path you chose, college or not.

I have worked in London, Berlin, Oxford, which is enough for me now, I get offered to work all over europe, at what I consider to be crazy prices, it's pretty nice, but I have opted to do my own thing with people that need help and support in my hometown as I found myself back here for some random reason... anyway. Keep asking people, keep thinking about it, pick something, and enjoy it. Life can go on for a while if you are careful, and your priorities can change over the years, keep it flexible!

Re: Ask HN: A 19 year old, what should I do?

#100

Post by zaccus »

I'm not going to directly contradict everyone here encouraging you to go to college, because that might be the best move for you or it might not.

However, I will say that if the only thing you want out of college is a degree, you will be bitterly disappointed when you graduate in 4 years with a ton of debt and no more employable than you are now. This is the case with millions of people, and there is no reason it shouldn't be the case with you.

If you decide to go to college, you need a crystal-clear idea of what you want to get out of the experience. 4 years is not a trivial amount of time to waste.

Keep in mind that college is always an option. There's no reason why everyone should go to college when they are 18 or 19. Time is on your side. If I were you I would keep gaining professional experience until a good reason to go to college presents itself.

Just to reiterate: nobody cares about a degree anymore. A monkey could get a degree. It is not an impressive accomplishment, and it is not in itself worth 4 years of your life. Take that into consideration, and if college still appeals to you then it might be worthwhile.

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