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Ask HN: Interesting TUIs (text user interfaces), maybe forgotten ones?

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Re: Ask HN: Interesting TUIs (text user interfaces), maybe forgotten ones?

#91

Post by neilv »

Where Emacs helps you with such homages is if you want the powerful programming environment for doing it, or the rich support for text buffers. (Or if you're doing it for practical use, for people who want to use Emacs.)

But if Emacs isn't a requirement, you might have an easier time doing many TUI things in Python or Rust, with one of their fancy libraries. Emacs can be made to emulate things like cursor-addressing, but the underlying representation, and the features layered upon it, aren't designed for that, and you have to fight them.

(BTW, after seeing the Canon Cat again on HN the other day, and realizing that the pointer buttons on a TrackPoint keyboard are just sitting there, waiting to be Leap keys, I had the thought of implementing that.)

Re: Ask HN: Interesting TUIs (text user interfaces), maybe forgotten ones?

#92

Post by cmrdporcupine »

GFA Basic on the Atari ST was great. Had code folding and autocomplete/intelligent syntax before most. Compact two-line menu at the top listing the currently-relevant keybindings.

WordStar and WordPerfect both were also fantastic things from that era that took advantage of the terminal environment.

Also, many IBM 3270 "green screen" apps in banks, stores, airlines, etc. were actually extremely well thought through. In the 90s they would get maligned and replaced with "better" Windows client-server GUIs, but usually the GUI was in the end inferior in terms of workflow and reliability.

When I was a minimum wage employee at Canadian Tire early 90s, the green-screen terminal-based inventory system was odd and unorthodox but actually very quick to work with and with decent design.

Re: Ask HN: Interesting TUIs (text user interfaces), maybe forgotten ones?

#93

Post by Someone »

Framework (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Framework_(office_suite)) was amazing.

It has been converted to be a Windows app and still is for sale, it seems doesn’t try hard to sell stuff (“For pricing information call or email us”), but its site (https://framework.com/) and doesn’t do the product justice, to be kind.

I couldn’t find a good demo either. https://youtu.be/RKR42Gmrydo?si=ILGJFiY33cFmcZ-o will have to do, but doesn’t show at all how easy it was to write small programs manipulating frames.

Re: Ask HN: Interesting TUIs (text user interfaces), maybe forgotten ones?

#94

Post by frederikvs »

Linux's `make menuconfig` [0] and GDB's TUI interface [1] are the first ones that come to mind. Both are very powerful once you get to know them a bit, and are still valuable tools today.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Menuconfig

[1] https://sourceware.org/gdb/current/onlinedocs/gdb.html/TUI.h...

Re: Ask HN: Interesting TUIs (text user interfaces), maybe forgotten ones?

#95

Post by cmrdporcupine »

Also... In terms of writing TUIs inside emacs ala magit, etc. it couldn't hurt to go look at the similar tools inside classic Lisp machines and older emacs (zmacs, etc) variants. Or even Oberon/Lilith or Perq or other machines of that era.

Definitely, the buffer-based metaphor rocks, and that way of working with things was kind of lost outside of emacs.

Re: Ask HN: Interesting TUIs (text user interfaces), maybe forgotten ones?

#96

Post by cmrdporcupine »

neilv wrote: post #91

Where Emacs helps you with such homages is if you want the powerful programming environment for doing it, or the rich support for text buffers. (Or if you're doing it for practical use, for people who want to use Emacs.) But if Emacs isn't a requirement, you might have an easier time doing many TUI things in Python or Rust, with one of their fancy libraries. Emacs can be made to emulate things like cursor-addressing,…

I was wondering if the canon cat leap stuff could be hoisted into emacs. I don't actually understand the Canon Cat, but from what I saw it didn't seem that far off from some of the way emacs is used.

Re: Ask HN: Interesting TUIs (text user interfaces), maybe forgotten ones?

#97

Post by cmrdporcupine »

busseio wrote: post #88

TinyMUSH (which is somewhere between TinyMUD and TinyMUSE if my historic memory is correct): https://github.com/TinyMUSH/TinyMUSH

Sure, or MOO.

Even better, a MOO (or any MUD) client in emacs (rmoo.el, mud.el etc), which is how I got my start with emacs eons ago.

Re: Ask HN: Interesting TUIs (text user interfaces), maybe forgotten ones?

#98

Post by morsch »

bitwize wrote: post #71

I've been faffing about with mainframe stuff lately using Hercules. So I'm going to nominate ISPF on mainframes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISPF Because the IBM mainframe world was late to the time-sharing party (ISPF was based on TSO, the Time-Sharing Option for System/360 and System/370, because the default mode for mainframes was batch processing from punched cards), and because IBM's 3270 terminal used screen-…

Not sure how related it is, but I found this series on the AS/400 fascinating: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL9tkJGALYJ6CzZSPwM-09E5tk...

Re: Ask HN: Interesting TUIs (text user interfaces), maybe forgotten ones?

#99

Post by neilv »

cmrdporcupine wrote: post #96
neilv wrote: post #91

Where Emacs helps you with such homages is if you want the powerful programming environment for doing it, or the rich support for text buffers. (Or if you're doing it for practical use, for people who want to use Emacs.) But if Emacs isn't a requirement, you might have an easier time doing many TUI things in Python or Rust, with one of their fancy libraries. Emacs can be made to emulate things like cursor-addressing,…

I was wondering if the canon cat leap stuff could be hoisted into emacs. I don't actually understand the Canon Cat, but from what I saw it didn't seem that far off from some of the way emacs is used.

Start with just a local key binding that makes the button hack into isearch implementation, and 10 minutes demonstrated proof-of-concept later, you keep going, and by the end of the weekend, you've recreated the Canon Cat in Emacs. :)
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