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Ask HN: Why do we need central bank digital currency (CBDC)?

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Re: Ask HN: Why do we need central bank digital currency (CBDC)?

#91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In short, permissioned digital currency is all the bad parts of crypto and none of the good parts, while simultaneously getting rid of all the good parts of cash. There's almost no benefit to the user that something else doesn't do better.

Incorrect. The benefits come from more informed macroeconomic policy, more targeted economic tools, and potential benefits around more targeted and effective sanctions against international bad actors. The idea is that the benefits to the user are a more stable economy (lower inflation, higher employment), a more effective safety net (politicians more likely to approve payments that can't be spent on gambling), and g…

>but there are legitimately good reasons to think they would.

There is no good reason for the government to have complete control over all of your finances and purchasing decisions on a granular level (if you value human freedom, autonomy and dignity at all).

Re: Ask HN: Why do we need central bank digital currency (CBDC)?

#92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Incorrect. The benefits come from more informed macroeconomic policy, more targeted economic tools, and potential benefits around more targeted and effective sanctions against international bad actors. The idea is that the benefits to the user are a more stable economy (lower inflation, higher employment), a more effective safety net (politicians more likely to approve payments that can't be spent on gambling), and g…

That gives a lot of weight to the idea that officials in the Fed (or your country's central bank) and government will make the best decisions for everyone given increased data produced by a digital currency. History doesn't really show that officials make the right decision even with sufficient data. For a small example, until a few months ago many US Treasury and Fed officials insisted that any inflation would be "t…

>For a small example, until a few months ago many US Treasury and Fed officials insisted that any inflation would be "transitory" at worst. Now many admit they were wrong,

That government officials are fallible and incompetent is (in my opinion) the weaker argument. Even if they were extremely competent and had a crystal ball that predicted the future (they don't), nobody should trust the intentions or the goals of government agencies with such ubiquitous and unchecked power.

Re: Ask HN: Why do we need central bank digital currency (CBDC)?

#93
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it will a be a stable currency that people actually use without even thinking about it to make instant money transfers at zero cost.

Because stable currencies do not exist in the world of cryptos? Dai [1], Rai [2], and USDC [3] are some examples that are all stable, and all dramatically different from each other. Fees are currently as low as $0.03 on Ethereum layer-2 solutions (!= side-chain) [4]. The fees will further fall as the technology improves, and once L1 gets (data-/dank-)sharding and other L2-scaling oriented upgrades. [1] https://makerd…

Fees are currently as low as $0.03 on Ethereum layer-2 solutions

Fees in crypto fantasy land are irrelevant to most people.

How much does it cost to pay your rent or buy food in the real world?

Re: Ask HN: Why do we need central bank digital currency (CBDC)?

#94
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> with a digital currency, they can simply zap your money away. Brazil did that in the 90s, digital currency wasn't needed.

Yes, but with an open, global system like bitcoin, they can't do this any longer.

Central banks kept printing money despite the existence of blockchains. There is an ongoing global inflation crisis as result.

It seems no Blockchain was able to overcome fundamental scalability issues, which are key to actual adoption.

Re: Ask HN: Why do we need central bank digital currency (CBDC)?

#95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Totally upside down and backwards. Crypto is all the bad parts of a CBDC and none of the good parts. A CBDC will eliminate any argument for crypto ... with the exception of paranoia ... which is unfounded since crypto keeps a public record of everything you do.

Governments are proven oppressors, Every single mass abuse of human rights, war, genocide has been carried out by government. Taking the power of the purse from government is the next big human rights issue of our age, rendering taxation by inflation impossible, and empowering individuals to hold government accountable.

Thank you for saving us from the evil of government. In the meantime, can I pay rent with crypto?

Re: Ask HN: Why do we need central bank digital currency (CBDC)?

#96
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A CDBC will be fully electronic/automated with instant results and operate 24/7/365 at insignificant cost. Why would CDBC cost less if it is an improvement in value over the previous systems of credit cards, checks, and cash? From the TANSTAAFL perspective, debit, checks and cash aren't free, the cost is explicit in account maintenance fees or hidden inside the difference in interest rates between what the bank get…

Why would CDBC cost less if it is an improvement in value over the previous systems of credit cards, checks, and cash? Because it will be *truly* computer automated and operate 24/7/365 without middlemen processors charging outlandish fees that are hidden from the consumer.

CDBC just becomes the “middlemen processors” only in singular. Aside from a hypothetical utopia, there is nothing that says it won’t do the same thing as the current processors. It won’t be free—even if no human is employed to maintain it. Current, cooling, hardware, network are all not without cost. From your description the best case for CDBC is to play underfunded and undermarketed generic to Visa/MC’s brand name pharmaco.

Re: Ask HN: Why do we need central bank digital currency (CBDC)?

#97
post #19

People don't need it, but governments want it very badly. It would provide governments with greater visibility into and control over the money supply and flows. This would be both at the macro (arguably good) and micro (arguably bad) levels. Just as here on HN we read from time to time about people being locked out of various online services (i.e. Google, Facebook etc.) for doing something a company doesn't like, a C…

> This can already be done to a degree via the banking system, but a CBDC would provide for much more granular control.

That's vague. Prove it.

Re: Ask HN: Why do we need central bank digital currency (CBDC)?

#98
CBDC will never catch on. It's worse than the existing system for everyone involved. This is just clueless bureaucrats trying to show how cool they are. Not to mention corporations trying to extract more money from the government by providing CBDC services.

Re: Ask HN: Why do we need central bank digital currency (CBDC)?

#99
post #19

People don't need it, but governments want it very badly. It would provide governments with greater visibility into and control over the money supply and flows. This would be both at the macro (arguably good) and micro (arguably bad) levels. Just as here on HN we read from time to time about people being locked out of various online services (i.e. Google, Facebook etc.) for doing something a company doesn't like, a C…

> This can already be done to a degree via the banking system, but a CBDC would provide for much more granular control. That's vague. Prove it.

See Russia and SWIFT for the most extreme example to date.

Re: Ask HN: Why do we need central bank digital currency (CBDC)?

#100
== I explain it in four economic levels, why it is critical and my personal view: == Example:

Micro: 1:Let´s say you need a small investment. Right now you need to apply for a finance structure at a bank or group of people with numbers about your projection. We have public insights right now, ´data-driven´ was the holy grail.

Meso: 2: What if you don´t have insights of the economy when crypto takes over? How is a local football club going to finance a new building? The wealth gap is increasing and clubs like that ore not self-suffienct.

Macro: 3: What happens is that the economy slows down at the economy due to indifference at the beginning of the supply chain. Many big online companies make money through adds, but if people don´t buy items to sell, then they don´t need to buy much adds, which means online companies make less money.

Meta: 4: Long-term investments are critical for any economy. You can´t hire people if you are not sure about future economic prospects. The central bank want to create stable economic growth. If they don´t know the numbers, they cant´t help. Small companies and big companies are in favour of a certain external stability, without that doing business projecting would be gambling. We don´t need that. ==

Why it is critical:

The big issue that needs prevention is that economics impact each other in a domino effect. Economies have movement up and down, the thing is that have accepted and dealt with the benefits over time much from a western perseptive and now that the global economy like america and china are more equall the impact of a downturn in china would impact america much more.

example: If war happens in another country in the world, we almost directly experience effect in other countries.

Classical economics and keynesian economics both argue about what is smart: More goverment or less goverment.

Goverment is in my eyes more a ethical motivator for the society. Goverments already impact economy through climate policy. I think that role of advocate of justice of society through economic policy could be right. That depands on the design of the decion making unit. === WHy: Tax in general is difficult, now with crypto it is going to be more difficult.

How: I think it is important that we should argue the cashflows of goverment in general.

What: I think all organisations should focus on being self-suffienct and let the goverment help those organisations with doing that for justice in society.

When & where: Less = more / more = less is my economic few. --> if something works self-suffient, try doing less = making time and capital available --> if somehting does not work = spend capital and time to make it self-suffient.

== I mean for example:

why are foodbanks not working together more effective? Why don´t we have more laws to help prevent food waste? Why don´t companies and locals sponsor foodbanks? Why are people volunteers without benefits?

I´m more worried about the people who suffer the most in economic downturns. == My point is that we can design the economy we would like to live in, we do that by developing crypto with it´s benefits, now we need to think about the impacts of the perspective from central banking. ==

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