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Ask HN: I built it, "they" didn't come...

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Re: Ask HN: I built it, "they" didn't come...

#91

Post by mikeklaas »

tgrass wrote: post #57
mcantor wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

StackOverflow: * Posting a question: I go to the site, click on "Ask," and post my question. * Searching for answers: I go to the site, type in my search, and search. Facebook: * Posting a photo: I go to the site and look for a camera icon. I can't find one, so I start clicking on stuff like "Account", "Home" and "Profile". Still nothing. I start clicking on everything that isn't a friend's wall post. Eventually I hi…

From now on, I'm using your method to post photos. Usually takes me twice as many steps as that.

It's actually much easier than you guys think. To post a photo on facebook:

- click once in the "what's on your mind box"

- click on the "attach photo" icon

Re: Ask HN: I built it, "they" didn't come...

#92

Post by sdizdar »

First, I'm 100% convinced that design does not sell the product. It some instances it is very important, but in other instances it is not.

I'm using many confusing and ugly products but since they solve my problem, I use them (all HA software product on market, etc.).

I believe the key to solve something people really need. Hey I still have problems how to do code reviews (for cheap - like $10 per seat) - something like google wave but code reviews.

Now, there is also problem how to get your message out and get people interested (since they might not know they have a problem you are solving). I was told to watch infomercials on TV and try to make something like that on your home page, blogs, forums...

Re: Ask HN: I built it, "they" didn't come...

#93

Post by hasenj »

joshklein wrote: post #54
loumf wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Features absolutely do sell software if the demand already exists. If you are entering an existing market, where the product category is known -- your set of features (not # of features) is a big part of what will drive sales. StackOverflow, for example, was sold on features. Look at the early pitches -- it's a reddit+wiki replacement for Experts Exchange. Developers already knew that PHPBB and EE sucked for Q&A. The…

But is it "voting and editing of old answers" what sells the service, or is it "finally, Q&A that doesn't atrophy over time, so it's worth investing your effort in making a great community"? The difference isn't features vs lack of features; it is features vs BENEFITS. This is the thing "business people" bring to the hackerverse.

business people bring "more features please so we can make the sale".

It's the designers who deserve the credit here, not the business people.

Plus, not all hackers are feature-centric. There are many hackers who understand design.

Re: Ask HN: I built it, "they" didn't come...

#94

Post by hasenj »

vindicated wrote: post #80
hasenj wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People don't come to facebook to post photos. The right thing to compare posting photos on facebook would be, maybe editing your user profile in stackoverflow. Also, posting on stackoverflow requires you to be familiar with Markdown, an obscure markup language based on conventions used by geeks on mailing lists. On facebook, the first thing you do is look at other people's posts and statuses. And that's incredibly ea…

It's incredibly easy for you because you know how facebook works. The first time I used facebook, I was like whaa? What's a WALL? What's the difference between a post and a note? How is sharing a link specifically different from embedding it in your status? Lots of complexity there, but we learn it after a while.

That's not my point.

People join facebook because all their friends are on it, and they get to see a news feed.

It's not instantly familiar or usable, and no one knows what's a wall or a news feed, but when you find pictures of a friend you haven't seen in 10 years, you'll probably stick around and try to figure it out.

Of course, at the beginning the only users where college students and people in their teens or twenties. But now even people in their forties join just because they can keep in touch with their distant relatives and old friends.

Re: Ask HN: I built it, "they" didn't come...

#95

Post by dfrankow »

loumf wrote: post #53
patio11 wrote: post #2

My projects are mostly based on features that are missing or misimplemented in the existing products. This is your first problem. First, features do not sell software . If there were a Ten Commandments of customer acquisition in the Internet age that would be #2 right after "Google is your god, you shall have no others." People use software and use websites because of the benefit that you credibly propose to bring to…

Features absolutely do sell software if the demand already exists. If you are entering an existing market, where the product category is known -- your set of features (not # of features) is a big part of what will drive sales. StackOverflow, for example, was sold on features. Look at the early pitches -- it's a reddit+wiki replacement for Experts Exchange. Developers already knew that PHPBB and EE sucked for Q&A. The…

> the demand flowed to them.

Their combined blog readership was huge. They capitalized on that audience, not just the features.

Re: Ask HN: I built it, "they" didn't come...

#96

Post by Travis »

loumf wrote: post #53
patio11 wrote: post #2

My projects are mostly based on features that are missing or misimplemented in the existing products. This is your first problem. First, features do not sell software . If there were a Ten Commandments of customer acquisition in the Internet age that would be #2 right after "Google is your god, you shall have no others." People use software and use websites because of the benefit that you credibly propose to bring to…

Features absolutely do sell software if the demand already exists. If you are entering an existing market, where the product category is known -- your set of features (not # of features) is a big part of what will drive sales. StackOverflow, for example, was sold on features. Look at the early pitches -- it's a reddit+wiki replacement for Experts Exchange. Developers already knew that PHPBB and EE sucked for Q&A. The…

Interesting point. But those "features" existed (albeit in a mediocre form). So maybe "implementation of features" or "quality of features" sells a product...?

Speaking just for myself: I don't use SO (or reddit) because of the features they offer. I use them because of the communities involved. I think that's the point here -- there are loads of sites that can compete on features (reddit, meet digg...) but lack something else. It's that "something else" that drives success (partially; I'm not suggesting it's entirely based on some esoteric quality, but that the specific quality can be different for different applications).

Re: Ask HN: I built it, "they" didn't come...

#97

Post by hinoglu »

metageek wrote: post #90
hinoglu wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well i didn't intend to gain attention to advertise my projects, but uhm.. :) one i'm lately struggling with is visitrs.com, i've posted it a few times before, did not get much response, ones i get was helpful though.It has started as a pluggible chat system which allowed visitors of any website to chat with eachother. It would provide interaction between visitors, would create a community around the website, would h…

Though demo was sufficient for simple ops, it needed transaction system implemented, which was really not a big deal. Couldn't sell it. Transactional integrity across replicas is a big deal--it is, in fact, the hard part. Telling people it's not makes them think you don't know databases and they shouldn't trust your code. Maybe they were wrong (maybe I'm wrong), but it sounds like that's the impression you were givin…

Ops sorry, "replica" is the important part here.

There's no replica in the system. There are clients (clients of messaging system are sql servers) that are not realated to any other sql server in no means, which receive the same commands from a web application in the very same order each time.

Replication is lightweight and done in the sql proxy by replicating the messages, not in the sql servers. Simply it's a 1-1 connection between a web-app and sql-server, but the messages are multiplied by the number of sql-servers which made it a 1-N real time cloning system.

Re: Ask HN: I built it, "they" didn't come...

#98

Post by PhrosTT »

rick888 wrote: post #58
PhrosTT wrote: post #5

maybe you're discounting the importance of luck... somehow society just decides your thing is cool. like when there's 5 equal products and one is successful for no particular reason. i always think about how weird bars are. you can 2 equal bars but 1 is packed every night... even with zero distinguishing differences. society just says 'oh that bar usually has people, let's go there'. the problem may not be the produc…

"like when there's 5 equal products and one is successful for no particular reason." I don't think it's chance. If there are 5 equal products and 1 is successful, there is a reason. You may not be able to see it right away, but it's probably due to: UI, marketing (the right people saw it), benefits, or simplicity. Look at twitter as an example of this. It's a simple idea and there were many other potential competitor…

I guess what I was referring to is that sometimes things just blow up.

At a certain point Rainbow sandals became the defacto sandal of southern frat boys. Did they market to them? No. Some influencer decided he liked them and it slowly spread. Now it's just the established norm. Most of society just follows trends. And if you're a company, you are at the mercy of these trends. Yes you can try to create them, but you can fail just because your rival got lucky.

Did Smirnoff Ice instigate Bros Icing Bros? No but they're sales spiked because of it.

Did PBR market to hipsters? No but they adopted it as their own and now PBR reaps the benefits.

Run DMC wrote about Adidas without being paid a cent. Was Adidas really BETTER than any other shoe brand? Adidas just kind of got lucky.

You may throw something back at me about reaching influencers... yes you can try to do that.... but to a certain degree you're at the mercy of society's whims.

Re: Ask HN: I built it, "they" didn't come...

#99

Post by rick888 »

PhrosTT wrote: post #98
rick888 wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"like when there's 5 equal products and one is successful for no particular reason." I don't think it's chance. If there are 5 equal products and 1 is successful, there is a reason. You may not be able to see it right away, but it's probably due to: UI, marketing (the right people saw it), benefits, or simplicity. Look at twitter as an example of this. It's a simple idea and there were many other potential competitor…

I guess what I was referring to is that sometimes things just blow up. At a certain point Rainbow sandals became the defacto sandal of southern frat boys. Did they market to them? No. Some influencer decided he liked them and it slowly spread. Now it's just the established norm. Most of society just follows trends. And if you're a company, you are at the mercy of these trends. Yes you can try to create them, but you…

"You may throw something back at me about reaching influencers... yes you can try to do that.... but to a certain degree you're at the mercy of society's whims."

You are right about this. But, the amount of companies that became successful due to this sort of luck are the exception rather than the rule. It doesn't happen that often.

Re: Ask HN: I built it, "they" didn't come...

#100

Post by mcantor »

Tomek_ wrote: post #78
mcantor wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

StackOverflow: * Posting a question: I go to the site, click on "Ask," and post my question. * Searching for answers: I go to the site, type in my search, and search. Facebook: * Posting a photo: I go to the site and look for a camera icon. I can't find one, so I start clicking on stuff like "Account", "Home" and "Profile". Still nothing. I start clicking on everything that isn't a friend's wall post. Eventually I hi…

Photos: Home > Profile > Photos (hello!!!) > Create new album > Select photos to upload. Has been more or less like that ever since I remember. Privacy is a different thing, it was once quite easy but everyone was crying that there's "too many options", so they made some mess with it.

The home screen is where I "do stuff," like make wall posts. It is not intuitive to go someplace else to upload photos into an album.
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