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Ask HN: Is a computer science degree worth it or should I learn on my own?

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Re: Ask HN: Is a computer science degree worth it or should I learn on my own?

#91

Post by elvecinodeabajo »

mtnGoat wrote: post #77
elvecinodeabajo wrote: post #75

Learning your own doesn't give you a grade or diplomas to prove how much you've studied. Another benefit of the degree is the already plannified roadmap, taking it's time to learn the basics in depth. And, of course, the teacher who answers the doubts that are coming and shows the advanced tricks he already know. Definitely, learning in your own is a good choice if you don't plan to work on infosec jobs. But without…

the opposite is quite true as well... a degree doesn't mean you've learned anything or are great at the things i need. of the 100+ engineers i've hired in the last decade, few had degrees and all of the top performers, aside from one, did not. dual edged sword in my opinion.

To read you've hired engineers without the degree. Some brilliant people just needs an oportunity. In tons of business they just discard the CV that don't show degrees. A good talent chasing makes this world better in a faster way. But not everybody can find the spark in potential genius.

Re: Ask HN: Is a computer science degree worth it or should I learn on my own?

#92

Post by iamjk »

protonimitate wrote: post #84
jl2718 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But CS pays, and engineering doesn’t. If you plan on getting a job, that engineering degree is worthless when you’re at a whiteboard and the interviewer is asking some canonical CS question requiring implementation of a data structure that you don’t know the name of. Also, engineering is hard, like, lifetime of accumulated knowledge hard. It’s true for CS as well, but there are so many kids running the show that it’l…

>>If you plan on getting a job, that engineering degree is worthless when you’re at a whiteboard and the interviewer is asking some canonical CS question requiring implementation of a data structure that you don’t know the name of. What software engineering program doesn't cover DS/A? Furthermore every answer to those cookie cutter whiteboard questions can be found in CTCI, leetcode, or any other DS/A textbook. Lets…

A good accredited CE curriculum will require all of the CS fundamentals.

Re: Ask HN: Is a computer science degree worth it or should I learn on my own?

#93

Post by johncole »

CyberFonic wrote: post #70

I would suggest getting a degree in engineering! Electrical, Computer, Software. The key to being effective in the long term is to be able to design and then implement system of systems. Astronomy is not about building telescopes and biology is not about designing microscopes. Whilst CS is a very important field, it could be likened to being like physics is to structural engineering. Physics study will teach you a lo…

Had to look it up.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effec...

As someone self taught in a lot of things, definitely don't know what you don't know.

Re: Ask HN: Is a computer science degree worth it or should I learn on my own?

#94

Post by elvecinodeabajo »

elvecinodeabajo wrote: post #91
mtnGoat wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the opposite is quite true as well... a degree doesn't mean you've learned anything or are great at the things i need. of the 100+ engineers i've hired in the last decade, few had degrees and all of the top performers, aside from one, did not. dual edged sword in my opinion.

To read you've hired engineers without the degree. Some brilliant people just needs an oportunity. In tons of business they just discard the CV that don't show degrees. A good talent chasing makes this world better in a faster way. But not everybody can find the spark in potential genius.

Well, this comments starts with "I feel happy..." Sorry.

Re: Ask HN: Is a computer science degree worth it or should I learn on my own?

#95

Post by wslh »

My two cents: in my relatively small sample of developers that I know, I see differences in the ones with and without degrees in the topics that require more study and discipline like operating systems, complexity, and formal theory. For example, people without a degree in general does not have a good background for developing multithreading systems or understanding that the problem they are trying to tackle is NP hard.

Re: Ask HN: Is a computer science degree worth it or should I learn on my own?

#96

Post by theonemind »

Buttons840 wrote: post #30
stevenwadejr wrote: post #12

I'm 33 years old and have been programming professionally for 11 1/2 years, and I'm self taught. I'm considered "senior". I founded and lead a user group and I've spoken at a conference. I don't say this to brag, I say this to state that despite my success and that a piece of paper won't advance my career, I've always regretted not having my degree. I'm married with a kid and I just started going back to school to fu…

How do you deal with classes like "intro to web development", where you will learn what a GET request is, when you've been a senior web developer for 10 years? (Just as an example, maybe you've worked in something other than web development?) Is cleping classes realistic?

He might not have any classes like that. I majored in computer science and mostly took classes like crytography, compilers, operating systems, automata theory, etc. They might have had some courses like intro to web dev, I wouldn't remember; I always wanted the "hardest" courses I could get. I could program before ever staring the curriculum (at 26). They had two mandatory weed-out courses early in the curriculum to bounce anyone who just didn't have the aptitude or likely ability to complete the program where I had to write some boring Java, but that's it. In other places in the curriculum or some classes, they did have some programming, but things that wouldn't bore most anyone (For one class, we had to write Tetris, for instance. In the operating systems class, we wrote an OS.)

Re: Ask HN: Is a computer science degree worth it or should I learn on my own?

#97

Post by Latteland »

CyberFonic wrote: post #70

I would suggest getting a degree in engineering! Electrical, Computer, Software. The key to being effective in the long term is to be able to design and then implement system of systems. Astronomy is not about building telescopes and biology is not about designing microscopes. Whilst CS is a very important field, it could be likened to being like physics is to structural engineering. Physics study will teach you a lo…

If you want to be a software engineer, study software engineering, not some other engineering area. I think electrical engineering is far less useful to people if they are going to be general software engineers than being a cs major. You will spend a lot of time learning things that won't matter to software engineering. Of course if you were going tl be employed as an electrical engineer, but if you only were trained as a software engineer, you wouldn't be able to be proficient either. Study the field you want to work in!

Re: Ask HN: Is a computer science degree worth it or should I learn on my own?

#98

Post by arthev »

Most CompSci programmes around the world are utterly bollocks and not worth the time investment from a learning perspective as you'll have to waste time on the tedious and unproductive coursework.

So the question really boils down to:

1. Do you want to work in academia? If so, get degrees.

2. Do you want a piece of paper showing you're a good cog in the machine? If so, get a degree.

3. Do you want to learn as much as possible? If so, skip the degrees and focus on learning.

Re: Ask HN: Is a computer science degree worth it or should I learn on my own?

#99

Post by CyberFonic »

Latteland wrote: post #97
CyberFonic wrote: post #70

I would suggest getting a degree in engineering! Electrical, Computer, Software. The key to being effective in the long term is to be able to design and then implement system of systems. Astronomy is not about building telescopes and biology is not about designing microscopes. Whilst CS is a very important field, it could be likened to being like physics is to structural engineering. Physics study will teach you a lo…

If you want to be a software engineer, study software engineering, not some other engineering area. I think electrical engineering is far less useful to people if they are going to be general software engineers than being a cs major. You will spend a lot of time learning things that won't matter to software engineering. Of course if you were going tl be employed as an electrical engineer, but if you only were trained…

In my experience (a very long way from SV) a significant proportion of excellent programmers did not do SE degree but had degrees in some other area. My analysis suggests that critical thinking, ability to comprehend requirements and do good design are critical skills and can be developed in many related fields.
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