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Ask HN: What are some tech companies that do not use an open floor plan?

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Re: Ask HN: What are some tech companies that do not use an open floor plan?

#91

Post by danielbarla »

blattimwind wrote: post #85
majewsky wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> maybe 60sqft-ish? For those of us with non-ridiculous units, that's 5-6 m².

That's rather small, even for a single-person office.

Sure, however I'm currently sitting in a kind of cubicle (on an open plan floor), with 4 developers sharing what seems to be about a 3.5m x 3.5m space (I'm 1.8m, and if we all stand up and put our arms out, they'd touch), which brings it to just under 13m2, or 3.2 m2 per person. There are teams that are more cramped than even this, which I find pretty sad.

Re: Ask HN: What are some tech companies that do not use an open floor plan?

#92

Post by brian-armstrong »

KozmoNau7 wrote: post #68
lowlevel wrote: post #48

They're all going this way. I've had to started adding 'well, I can' t do the work here' in front of every 'when can you have this done' response.

It has gotten to the point where I'm seriously considering just working from home every day, even though that's strictly not allowed. Open-plan offices are absolutely maddening, I get pulled out of my thoughts constantly, and there's no effective way to shut it out. Earplugs aren't enough, and with headphones I would have to play music so loudly it would be annoying my colleagues, just in order to cut out the constan…

You might try earplugs and earmuffs at the same time. It's a pretty effective level of sound isolation.

Re: Ask HN: What are some tech companies that do not use an open floor plan?

#93

Post by kamaal »

brann0 wrote: post #75
Lammy wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Follow the money. It’s cheaper to build, easy to shuffle, and people will put up with it. I know I do.

Cheaper in the short term. If your engineers productivity is constantly tanking because of noise and interruptions it will mean lots of wasted money. But you can't factor that in a spreadsheet, right?

I wonder how many of these problems happen because of outdated management practices since the days of serfdom that treat people as two hands and with hours in a day whom they have to whip enough to pick as much cotton as they can.

So many companies are full of upper management who think as engineering output the way one would run a chair manufacturing firm. Too many people think everything there is in a chair has been made, and the only scope left now is a little innovation here and there. All they have to do is get people to saw, hammer and glue as quickly as they can.

Re: Ask HN: What are some tech companies that do not use an open floor plan?

#94

Post by hordeallergy »

It's not acceptable. I've moved from a dev background to having a go at sre/devops/something-or-other; work aside, the culture is excrutiating, with people shouting across the office all day. Best case, someone talking to themself hour after hour, as if anyone wants to hear that. The idea that open floor plans are productive is farce. I effectively have two jobs, the first being just trying to get any work done.

Re: Ask HN: What are some tech companies that do not use an open floor plan?

#95

Post by lnsru »

tomohawk wrote: post #74

The schools in our area are in the final phases of remodeling, getting rid of the open floor plan layout that was in vogue when many of the schools were built, and was such a disaster. Nice to see taxpayer money hard at work. It's funny that a business as reactionary as the education system seems to have learned this lesson but tech companies haven't.

German universiteties in Munich, Dresden and probably elsewhere have separate rooms for the staff. Usually 2-4 persons per room. It’s really nice and productive.

Later I found similar setting during interview at Viavi Solutions. All other bigger enterprises had open space offices. Some with cubicles, some with glas walls and some with tables only.

Re: Ask HN: What are some tech companies that do not use an open floor plan?

#96

Post by smichel17 »

davidmoffatt wrote: post #22

Yes I too would love to see this. Noise canceling headphone seem to cancel everything but voices and that is the opposite of what you need.

My preferred setup is earplugs with headphones over them.

The headphones muffle outside noise to some degree and add music to drown out what they can't muffle. The earplugs create an end result of just muffled music, which is basically white noise if you pick the right type of songs.

The only downside is that earplugs can get uncomfortable after a long period of wearing them.

Re: Ask HN: What are some tech companies that do not use an open floor plan?

#97

Post by SJetKaran »

blitzo wrote: post #70
rdl wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the office concept I've always wanted to build. It would be cool if someone from the company could document it/blog post/etc. -- might be good for recruiting too. (Especially since Viasat does pretty cool stuff -- excited about the new Exede sat expanding coverage...) I was thinking it would make sense to have roller doors or some other way to open the entire side of the office (on both sides -- "neighborhood"…

I find this https://imgur.com/CvtAHgZ IKEA Mandal divider turn-into cubicle reach a compromising middle ground between open and closed space.

This seems like a really neat model to try out.

Re: Ask HN: What are some tech companies that do not use an open floor plan?

#98

Post by nailer »

hordeallergy wrote: post #94

It's not acceptable. I've moved from a dev background to having a go at sre/devops/something-or-other; work aside, the culture is excrutiating, with people shouting across the office all day. Best case, someone talking to themself hour after hour, as if anyone wants to hear that. The idea that open floor plans are productive is farce. I effectively have two jobs, the first being just trying to get any work done.

SRE/DevOps should generally be like dev: if you're in an open office, headphones on.

> Best case, someone talking to themself hour after hour, as if anyone wants to hear that.

The person who is speaking usually needs to hear it. Sorry, I talk to myself every so often. :)

Re: Ask HN: What are some tech companies that do not use an open floor plan?

#99

Post by fsloth »

sheepmullet wrote: post #89
Moodles wrote: post #86

Have there been any studies on what kind of office floor plans are actually optimal for work?

> Have there been any studies on what kind of office floor plans are actually optimal for work? It's hard - every study of individuals shows they are significantly less productive in an open office environment. But what second order effects are there? You might be less productive individually but it might encourage team work and make the team as a whole more effective.

"You might be less productive individually but it might encourage team work and make the team as a whole more effective."

Team room is not an open office. Open office is a place where a number of teams congregate.

And open offices generally seem to hurt even team work, so the only thing speaking for an open office is that it's cheaper. Any other 'advantages' are just marketing by consultants whose business is to develop open offices and site managers (or the corresponding financially responsible party) who want to save on their budget.

If you are employing fairly expensive software engineers I'm not sure you should implement savings on a less expensive resource that will just devalue the output from your expensive resource.

http://www.bbc.com/capital/story/20170105-open-offices-are-d...

Re: Ask HN: What are some tech companies that do not use an open floor plan?

#100

Post by eeZah7Ux »

skriticos2 wrote: post #84
KozmoNau7 wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has gotten to the point where I'm seriously considering just working from home every day, even though that's strictly not allowed. Open-plan offices are absolutely maddening, I get pulled out of my thoughts constantly, and there's no effective way to shut it out. Earplugs aren't enough, and with headphones I would have to play music so loudly it would be annoying my colleagues, just in order to cut out the constan…

Use noise cancelling headphones. They shut out the world with a bit of quiet music. I love my qc35. Doesn't fix the primary issue, but makes it more bearable.

> noise cancelling headphones

They are very ineffective against voices! Passive insulating headphones are much better.

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