I had this exact same experience. You're basically fucked. The whole world is like that and it takes effort and balls to get anything interesting to happen. My advice: ignore school completely, and work on learning the skills you want to learn, and learn them really well and inside out. Also learn business skills, because somebody like you is going to need to operate independently. My advice would be to get a self-sustaining business off the ground as quickly as possible. Learn some scripting languages, work your ass off, and it's OK to flunk out of school. If your parents aren't cool with that, too fucking bad. Here's how you win that fight: set up a self-sustaining business on the Web before you flunk out of school. All you have to do is get the timing right. As long as you're already making enough money to get your own apartment by the time your school flunks you, it won't matter.
Ask HN: I'm in 10th grade and I hate school. Any suggestions?
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Re: Ask HN: I'm in 10th grade and I hate school. Any suggestions?
#82First let me say, I know exactly how you feel and that you're 100% right. Don't think for a second that there's anything wrong with you. I'm a 4th year in college right now and it'll take me 5 to graduate. I've always been in the top half of my classes and wondered why we had to learn so much useless crap. I talked to my 8th grade humanities teacher about this and he told me that "The system's not perfect. Work through the system first, then change it after you're out of it if it bothers you that much." I'm not suggesting you try to reform the education system, but this was some good advice for me, and I hope it helps you.
Coincidentally, my girlfriend is just graduating college from learning to a be a grade school teacher. She's taught me something very important over the last year or so: that school is not really about learning the subjects your teachers are trying to teach you, it's about you developing as a person. Maybe it would help if you thought of high school as a social learning environment rather than an academic one. Let me also say that in no way do I mean that just because you're in 10th grade does that mean that you're not mature or intelligent. Everyone can improve themselves in many ways, not just academically, and that's what I suggest you focus on in school.
You're going to have boring tasks to do when you have a job, or when you live on your own, so it's best to learn how to get through them now and appreciate the genuinely interesting subjects while you can. I have had about a 50/50 split with good/bad professors in college and I'm assuming that this carries over into the professional world. You'll probably have some co-workers who are like you, and care about doing well, and some that just do it for the money.
You're way ahead of me as far as figuring these things out; I didn't start programming until the middle of my 3rd year in college. I also didn't read PG's high school essay until very recently, and I wish I had read it when I was your age. At the last career fair I went to, all three of the recuiters I talked to told me they wanted candidates with programming experience outside of class. You're well ahead of the curve and it sounds like you've got a good head on your shoulders. Try not to get discouraged and remember there are lots of people out there that feel the same way you do.
I hope this gives you some perspective and encouragement. I wish you the best of luck in your endeavors.
Re: Ask HN: I'm in 10th grade and I hate school. Any suggestions?
#83I was going to suggest a GED and early admission into college and such here (as others have, and that's a potential path I wish I knew about when I was your age), but there's another good option here.
Continue to slog through school (and that was no fun in my era, and has likely only become more of a slog) and get into every AP and into every local college class you can, and look to get an LLC and start up your own business and your own products. See if you're ready to operate a small business or a startup entirely on your own, or if you prefer to follow a, um, more traditional educational and career and corporate path.
If you work through the LLC and the AP and the college classes and particularly work with the local school authorities around this, you might be able to achieve a "reduced sentence" for your time in high school, too. Stranger things have happened.
Re: Ask HN: I'm in 10th grade and I hate school. Any suggestions?
#84Oh also: have sex with as many high school girls as you can. It's great, and it's only legal while you're still in high school too. School will give you a very few things worth learning and a very large number of high school girls you can meet. It's very clear what school is for. If school was for learning, it would give you a few girls to meet and a ton of things to learn. QED. Recognize that school is a terrible place to learn but an excellent place to get laid, and react appropriately. It's especially important for you to socialize when you're at school because it's pretty obvious that in your free time you would rather learn than socialize. You can't stop school from wasting your time, but you do get to choose whether it eats time out of your learning budget or your socializing budget.
Re: Ask HN: I'm in 10th grade and I hate school. Any suggestions?
#85It's very good that you came out with this instead of shyly shelfing it away as a 'selfish' thought. I've been through exactly what you're going through, and it's not selfish in any way. You want to achieve your potential (which in the longer run, would help the world in some way), and high school is proving a hindrance to you.
Many of the other commenters don't seem to understand your issue (assuming I do). Yes, you can socialize a lot in high school and participate in other things. Most of these 'other things' turn out to be as fake as the 'education' the school provides. But that's even not the issue here. I would bet that, even with a lot of 'socializing', unless you lose your core thirst to learn (which would definitely be a bad thing), you would be left with an empty feeling and a bitter taste at the end of the day.
And no, "real life is boring too" is no more true that you make it to be. Most adults stick to the 'system' (just like most students don't think of how much high school is wasting their time and stick to it) and do not pursue what they truly enjoy. When your actual job (and its purpose) is something you truly enjoy, these 'mundane' tasks of dealing with accountants and such would not appear big to you at all - they'll just happen.
I felt the exact same way as you do in college (which is not very different from school where I live), and coped with it with some tactics. The first one was what charlesju's comment says: "When I was in High School I used to pass the time by programming on my graphing calculator. I'm sure these days you can get by with reading a book in class or maybe even a small netbook. If none of those things are possible, just start a project and doodle your algorithms while you're in class and code them up at night. There are a lot of ways to circumvent the system and do something you like to do, don't just give in to your immediate urges to shut it out. At the very least, you should graduate High School." (http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=583462)
Some other comments here that I think would be useful to you:
"Treat high school as an experience, not as a place to go to learn- you've mastered the learning part (at least you better by getting rockstar grades), make a good effort to master the rest." - unexpected
"Stick with it, for now. It's not so much that it's a very valuable experience, it's that without it you will be locked out of so many other things that really are worthwhile. I know that two more years feels like an eternity right now, but trust me, it's not." - felixc And a word of caution here, see if applies to you: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=583453 - tracy
Finally, whatever you do, get rid of this 'guilt' that you are doing something wrong. I myself was affected a lot by it, until at the end when we interviewed for jobs, I saw clearly that those who had gone with the system mostly failed, but those of us who tried to break out and learn ourselves faired exceedingly well. So be aware that you are part of an elite group and would be very welcome at the real world.
Unfortunately, many of the comments here too seem to reinforce that you are simply being immature, but your comment indicates to me you are not. In that case, be clear about this: some of us just can't bring ourselves to go along with the 'system'. Once you've seen how mind numbingly foolish it is, it is very difficult to stay there (I'm reminded of the film The Matrix). So, there's nothing wrong about that being difficult for you.
But realise that this difficulty is something you have to overcome. Simply dropping out will complicate many other things in life, so I would not recommend it. Instead, understand yourself, and find ways to work around the system and make it palatable to you. If you forget about what the classes are actually supposed to teach and instead think deeply about what is being taught, you'll find that every moment can teach you a lot. Same goes for any work you're assigned - simply overperform (according to your standards - the school may not consider it excellent performance, but you know to ignore it). Research deeply about any assignment you're given, and if you're unable to do that (due to say lack of time), brainstorm yourself while writing down (or typing out) about the concept there. If you do this sincerely, you'll find that you enjoy the process, while excellent grades come your way without even all the 'hard work' the 'sincere' students put in.
To summarize the idea - you're interested in learning a lot, so use the things you do at school to do it; when you do the school work with concentration and dedication, you'll find that you've learnt a lot more than the teacher meant you to, while enjoying every moment of it.
Re: Ask HN: I'm in 10th grade and I hate school. Any suggestions?
#86Take every AP exam available, that will knock off all the easy classes in college that will equally waste your time and you can get out of some high school classes now and do it as independent study. I took 5 or 6 in my junior and aced them all - including two for subjects I had never even had class in. Just pick up some princeton review books and go at it. By the time I got to college I had 40 credits already done.
They had some fairly decent AP classes at my school that were challenging enough if you took several of them. I remembered thinking the first 11 years of school were a waste, but the last two weren't bad.
I also highly recommend AP courses.
Re: Ask HN: I'm in 10th grade and I hate school. Any suggestions?
#87My comment will get lost in the noise, but I'll give you an insight here that you will likely hardly hear again: You want a thrill of success. At the age you are in, your brain is hardwired to search for success. Programming gives you success, because when a piece of code compiles, you get that feeling of success. School is not doing so. So you will compulsively chase programming, trying to get your success fix. Turn…
Great advice. You don't realize it, but you have opportunities being handed to you now that won't come so easily later. I miss school (high school & college) for so many reasons. Having lots of peers right there to talk to. So many activites. A library full of books. Sports and clubs. A wide variety of subjects.
A mentor once told me to take advantage of everything available to you on your "school buffet". That's what it's there for. It's a great opportunity to be exposed to many different things, easily, and for free. How else will you know if you like it? Sure, you may not like the class in English literature or the ballet or playing soccer in P.E. But try it anyway.
Years from now you'll probably be sitting in a cubicle by day and changing diapers by night wishing you could experience something new and different once in a while. Now is your chance. Do it.
Re: Ask HN: I'm in 10th grade and I hate school. Any suggestions?
#88"I'm introverted and spend most of my time reading or obsessively working on hobbies like programming"
You might want to read the book The Introvert Advantage by Marti Laney, "Caring for Your Introvert" in The Atlantic (http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200303/rauch) and Philip Zimbardo's The Time Paradox, which I wrote about here (http://jseliger.com/2008/09/01/the-time-paradox-—-philip-zim...).
Notice this commenter's idea: "[...]the academic part of high school is not challenging enough for you, but what about the other parts? Are you on one of your school's sport team? Are you part of any clubs? Did you try to take on some kind of leadership position at your school? How big is your friend circle?"
High school still offers many, many challenges, even if you don't realize it; for me, working on the school newspaper and joining the book club made a tremendous difference in how I perceived much of life.
"I was just wondering if you guys had any experiences or suggestions to share about school."
School is a game. Make it your mission to learn how to crack the game, which doesn't mean you have to neglect your "real" education, as it sounds like that will happen chiefly on your own time. And what you consider "wastes of time" aren't always: they're opportunities to network, or to learn how to flirt, or to learn how to get away with things, and so on and so forth. These are important skills too, but many nerds ignore them for too long.
A final book recommendation: try Curtis Sittenfeld's novel "Prep." It's not about someone in your situation, but it is about someone who, I think, finally learns how to "do" school. If you're as analytic as your post implies that you are, it's possible to learn this. Anyway, the personal website I linked to above has my e-mail address if you're interested in hearing more.
Re: Ask HN: I'm in 10th grade and I hate school. Any suggestions?
#891. You aren't interested in school because you're not making your time at school interesting. 2. You are naive. Highschool is a mechanism to socialize you and a filter for colleges. Nothing that goes on there is a waste of time. 3. Start acting like a Gr. 10 student.
This is, to be perfectly blunt, utter nonsense of the highest degree. - You can't make something interesting when your time is controlled minute-by-minute. If you were stuck in India for the next four years, you could find some way to make it interesting because you have freedom. You simply can't make, say, prison interesting if it's not already, because everything is so rigidly controlled. - High school is NOT there…
I think you are being too extreme here.
'For another, your friends are chosen by accidents of age and geography, and not by you.'
this seems patently false to me, you hang out with the people who energize and care about you whether you are 16 or 25...
I mean, yes it's true that high school is boring and has many flaws, but it really doesn't take up that much time, and you can get a lot out of it. Classes can be boring and stifling, but I would argue that going to college without at least calculus isn't the best idea if you plan to have a lot of time to learn all the cool math you want/need.
Also, as some previous posters mentioned, until you're kicking everyone's ass and winning math/programming competitions, I don't think it's fair to say that school is too easy
Re: Ask HN: I'm in 10th grade and I hate school. Any suggestions?
#90Consider yourself lucky. There are plenty of paths open for you. (And that is why is difficult)
If I went back to high school? I would really focus in sports. It would teach me discipline, team work, and a lot of social skills.
After that, Try to get in a good college so you meet a lot interesting people. Follow your curiosity.
...keep hanging out in HN. Lot's of talent here.