Programming doesn't exist in a vacuum. Or better, there are some projects that only require programming skills, but many other require also skills in different areas. E.g. to write an automatic controller you need to know control theory and systems theory, to write a videogame's physics engine you need to know physics and so on. If one is an excellent programmer, but doesn't have at least some knowledge of the field where he's going to apply programming to, he's not going far. Conversely, a person that has a firm understanding of at least the basics of that field can do meaningful work without being a programming super star. So I would say, try to find some more specific field to apply programming to. Don't be a generic programmer but someone that is good at programming something specific.
Ask HN: Is programming a “young person's game”?
81–90 of 151 posts
Re: Ask HN: Is programming a “young person's game”?
#82It's absolutely not.
I think a big part of the myth comes from barely-legal techbros repeating what they heard, and maybe high-fiving each other. I half-jokingly blame PG for seeding this idea into early dotcom startups that took over tech, but I suppose it would've happened anyway (consider stereotypical teenagers thinking adults are dumb).
One thing that does happen is that, as you learn more, you're not as easily impressed with yourself.
Another thing that does happen is that a lot of people put their time and energy into other things. This is a long discussion, and I can hear the objections, but addressing them pre-emptively was getting too lengthy.
Another thing that happens is we forget how hard it was to learn some things that now seem easy. Besides the implications for collaborating with or teaching people who haven't yet learned particular difficult things, we need to remember it for ourselves, when we have to learn something new (and leveraging things already known isn't enough). Discouragement is a big deal at any age.
Health can slow down an individual in general. And that's important for 20yos to understand for themselves, not for generalized prejudice against others. Good nutrition, good sleep, exercise, try to avoid serious injuries (and when injured, make sure you're getting good medical advice on recovering properly), don't be shotgunning "energy drinks" and coffee or worse, don't think you're managing bad stress just by getting through it (nope, you're doing possibly permanent damage), mental health, good relationships, establishing financial security (too bad we don't just have this by default in a wealthy country, but until we do, financial security leads to better health, and can also solve problems that come up).
If you want to get into software, it just takes time and effort. You can start very vocation-oriented (e.g., do nothing but learn and practice React), or you can be guided more by curiosity and getting a broader diversity of experience over a longer period, and see what you end up diving into deeper. Or both.
Re: Ask HN: Is programming a “young person's game”?
#83I missed being a kid prodigy as well. Started programming on C64 in BASIC at age 12. Why I never learned assembly language is beyond me; for what ever reason I don't recall it being on my radar. After high school I went to college for computer science only to drop out after a year and a half and joined the Air Force.
But anyways, eventually the search for getting laid and getting drunk gave way to keeping up with programming. I tinkered around with programming while in the AF but didn't do much.
The itch to program never left though I ignored it for a LONG time.
At 40 I started on a Master's in CS (have a BS in engineering). Graduated at 45. I did remote part time jobs from 45 to 50. Got my first remote full time job at 50 during the middle of Covid in June 2020.
I just switched jobs to a major health care org at 52. It is a Java / Spring Boot / Angular position. I was completely honest with them that I hadn't done Java since MS degree (95% of courses were in Java). Never did any Spring Boot and only did one project with Angular 1.0. And they still hired me.
After a month I kind of felt over my head so I asked my team lead why they hired me. Her answer was people with some experience expected way too much money and/or they weren't willing to learn. She said I was at least willing to learn. I got a 20% boost to what I was making at the job I left, plus amazing benefits so win-win-win for me. I still have a lot to learn; Spring Boot and Angular seems very heavy to me coming from Python / Flask / HTML / CSS / vanilla JS but it is all starting to come together.
Right now my personal interest is Common Lisp. So in the mornings, at night and on weekends I delve into a CL book. It's going slow mainly because I ... SQUIRREL. But whatever, I'm in no big rush.
Moral of story: Continuously learning, be willing to learn, be honest to yourself and employers. Play on your strengths, don't deny your weaknesses and work on them.
Re: Ask HN: Is programming a “young person's game”?
#84I am in my 40’s and probably programming more now than I did in my 20’s. I enjoy exploring new languages and new paradigms. That feeling of impacting someone somewhere with code I’ve written is intoxicating - much more when someone pays a $1 to use a product or service I had a hand in. Throw in speed and cost optimizations and it all feels great.
I am married with kids and life can get busy. Programming sometimes feels like a guilt free escape especially when compared to gaming or watching sports. I manage my time better because I’m forced to which makes my programming escapes much more organized and impactful.
Re: Ask HN: Is programming a “young person's game”?
#85You can be Grug: https://grugbrain.dev/ Software engineering needs ten self-aware Grugs for every child prodigy. Getting in might be hard though. See, I’ve been on the hiring side and guilty as charged, I have passed on people aiming for Junior positions later in life. Not because ageism or anything, but because I need to make sure I have someone who just likes tinkering and staring at a monitor the whole day, not so…
I agree with this.
And I'm approaching 40, still like to stare at screen and tinker whole day, though do less and less of it as I get more and more attracted intellectualy to build companies and not only software product.
Re: Ask HN: Is programming a “young person's game”?
#86I don't know if it's scientific, but I like to refer as the 10,000 hours rules : to acquire a very good level, you need 5 years of work.
If you are 30, at 35 you will have a very good level. So there is still time. Even if you are 70, it's always time to invest in a new skill.
Re: Ask HN: Is programming a “young person's game”?
#87My uncle “wasted 10 years of his life” as a monk in the Pacific Northwest. Back to school at your age and all the comp sci classes were full so he started a math track and was able to pick up a few programming courses along the way.
Talent + motivation + time = success.
He’s now retired with an amazing career behind him in tech from Microsoft (white collar slavery he called it) to innovating online ticketing for a still going US airline.
Re: Ask HN: Is programming a “young person's game”?
#88Errrr. It has nothing to do with age. You can start programming at any age. What matters is not having youthfully crackling synapses, but motivation, curiosity, hard work. Though a youthful memory certainly would be a help, it’s nothing more than an enhancement to your capabilities. Experience counts for more. 30 is still young to start programming. At 30 you can still spend 30 years programming till retiring at 60.…
Great advice as I’m sitting here telling myself an others I have mastered the guitar after almost 30 years and I NEED something new.
Re: Ask HN: Is programming a “young person's game”?
#89I'm 35, and i've done A LOT of tech hiring. I've witnessed first-hand other managers making comments about "older" coders such as "well, do we think they're going to be adapable?" or "Is it a good culture fit?"
These questions are always thinly veiled ageism.
Regardless of age, some people become set in their ways. With age, this becomes more apparent and noticeable because people are looking for it. Sometimes being older DOES mean a lack of open mindedness and adaptability.
I think the perfect hire is a young head on old shoulders. Experience, wisdom, intuition, a lack of dogma, honed pragmatism ... but also a willingness to be wrong and persist, a ragged determination that comes with youthful foolishness.
So, even for me, age does correlate with some negative traits that MAY develop. I try my best to stay current, but use my developed nose to sniff out the fads, trends and anything without substance.
I feel this in myself and others provides massive value, more than the benefits of youth.
Re: Ask HN: Is programming a “young person's game”?
#90[deleted]