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Ask HN: Why is the printer industry so scammy?

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Re: Ask HN: Why is the printer industry so scammy?

#81

Bit off topic, but what printer would people recommend for someone who needs one every now and then, that is capable of color prints and scanning, that won't stop working when unused for several months? I'm getting the impression ink jet is not the way to go due to the long pauses, but the color lasers are all seem very expensive for such occasional use.

Pick up a Brother color laser. They are one of the least hostile to their customers, and their prices are reasonable. Buy new if you have to, but if you can find one a few years old in good condition, I find their older models to be the most reliable and least scammy...

Thanks! I'll take a look.

Re: Ask HN: Why is the printer industry so scammy?

#82

One "scam" that I realise HP is pulling: my OfficeJet 8710 printer seems to be cleaning its print heads every time it's turned on. I've gotten "please replace ink cartridges" messages when I've never even printed a single page since I replaced the previous cartridge — since I use the printer mostly for its ADF scanning function. Well, that's ~$100 I'll never get back. It's sad that the industry has moved in this dire…

That is something they often do. I recall one of the times I bought a HP with document feeder and scanner that it was rated one of the most economic in terms of its cleaning. Some of them consume insane amounts of ink just cleaning themselves on a daily basis or on start whereas other models from HP are rated some of the best in the inkjet industry for this and use very little.

Re: Ask HN: Why is the printer industry so scammy?

#83

Toner printers are "less scammy", at least in my experience. I had a HP one and always bought the genuine cartridges. Then I saw those videos about the printing industry scams (which does happen) and tried a third party toner that costs 1/5 of the price. Guess what? After like 10 perfect printed pages, it started leaking some powder, then stopped printing random chunks of the page and turned impossible to use. I went…

I also have laser printer. It’s ancient low budget color(!) Dell with genuine cartridges. Yes, they were expensive, but now the price is dropping. And I never had any quality issues with genuine cartridges on this device. Before I toyed with all the cheap ink jets and drying nozzles. Extremely bad experience.

Re: Ask HN: Why is the printer industry so scammy?

#84
post #26
post #6

Laser printers are the way to go. They are typically for offices and follow a different business level: large volume printing and low-cost ink.

Anything color that's reasonably priced?

They're reasonably priced if you consider that toner doesn't dry up like ink does.

If you only need to print a few times per year, it's far cheaper to buy a laser w/ toner. With inkjet, you'll have to buy (and wait for) new ink cartridges because they dry out in less than a year.

If you need to print a lot of color materials frequently and don't mind the quality, then ink jet is a better deal.

Re: Ask HN: Why is the printer industry so scammy?

#85

I used to work for Lexmark, back when they were in the inkjet business. They are perhaps most notable for starting and fueling the race to the bottom in printer price. The theory was that if you could lock the users in, the customer lifetime value would be made on selling profitably prices supplies (i.e. the ink cartridge). There were a few big problems with this: - People often could buy a new printer, with supplies…

Just an anecdote: my grandfather passed away a few years ago and he was always into new technology. After he passed when we were cleaning up his home we found no fewer than 11 inkjet printers in his basement. Every time one stopped working (probably ran out of ink, or printed poorly because of long delays between printing) he would go to Best Buy, get talked up by a salesperson about a nice new printer, and buy it. I…

>> he would go to Best Buy, get talked up by a salesperson about a nice new printer, and buy it.

In a past life I worked at Best Buy, and the standard printer sales tactics were nuts. If a customer wanted to buy a printer, you were supposed to sell them:

  2 packs of color ink (remind the customer that the included cartridges are only half-full)
  2 packs of black ink
  4 reams of regular paper
  2 packages of photo paper
  GOLD printer cable
  The Best Buy Service Plan, of course

Re: Ask HN: Why is the printer industry so scammy?

#86
post #23

Printers are the most mechanically complex computer related product. Just think, fans are basically single bearing and motor. Pumps are pretty much same. Traditional spinning disk, nearly closed system with two motors. Printers have multiple times this complexity. And the products bought are bought for lowest price. Or at least reasonable price. You get what you pay for. And what is paid is often very little. Thus po…

It's still magic for me how they can get just 1 sheet of paper at a time.

I lol'd at this. :D

Re: Ask HN: Why is the printer industry so scammy?

#87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"updating the drivers" no Good printers use PS/PCL, nobody cares about drivers, a generic one usually works

Quoted post unavailable.

"Postscript" and "printer control language". They're standardized printer input formats.

Re: Ask HN: Why is the printer industry so scammy?

#88

Why can't paper printers be more like 3D printers? Amazing repairability, many suppliers of standardized source material...

Some of the companies are trying to move to much more streamlined initial setups and propriety parts to bring more reliable printing but at least for now the amount of open repairable printers is more than sufficient and popular.

Re: Ask HN: Why is the printer industry so scammy?

#89
Possibly, when a market or a business isn't growing, it's dying, so they make shorter term decisions that ignore conseqeunces and externalities the managers don't believe they will be around for.

Detecting scammy behaviour could be a leading indicator of an inflection point in a market or company where its growth phase is behind it. Printer companies are responding to paperlessness by hollowing out the goodwill of their customers, because there is no longer any long term value in it.

Re: Ask HN: Why is the printer industry so scammy?

#90

> In particular, there is some brand that was praised for consumer friendly practices here on HN that joined the dark side recently too; Brother iirc. What did Brother do to join the "dark side"? I and lots of other folks love our Brother laser printers. I haven't heard of them doing anything evil...

I'm also a halfway happy Brother laser customer. Except sometimes the scanner missing the computer (which means restarting both printer and computer) no complaints here. Can't say the same about Epson or HP, myg what for a garbage called software they install on your comp...
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