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Ask HN: Tips for Reducing the Number of Inboxes

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Re: Ask HN: Tips for Reducing the Number of Inboxes

#81

Post by karpierz »

endisneigh wrote: post #61
karpierz wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> tell me then, how exactly would this work as new features are developed - do all apps have to be static in functionality indefinitely? Can you give an example of a "new feature" that you think would be stymied by this? > how would it work with group chats where you can add and remove people arbitrarily? I don't quite understand what issue you're pointing to. I'm not sure if you're unsure of how e2e encryption works…

Sending money for example. Haven’t kept up to date with matrix - does it even allow e2ee with group chats using a bridge?

Why would requiring interoperability of messages or video calls prevent an app from implementing a "send money" feature?

Also, if you want to make a "send money" feature, why would it being interoperable preclude you from doing it? Bank transfers are already interoperable, why can't a send money feature be?

> e2ee with group chats

See: https://interoperability.news/2022/03/end-to-end-encrypted-g...

Re: Ask HN: Tips for Reducing the Number of Inboxes

#82

Post by bhawks »

albertzeyer wrote: post #80
bhawks wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just because they can doesn't mean they should. Should they mandate that video game platforms be interoperable? What about mandating that every company produces apps that interoperate with windows Mac Linux and mobile.

Difficult question indeed. And that even leaving aside the technical questions. But wouldn't it be nice? Netflix, Amazon, Apple, Disney, all together? Or always cross platform apps? Is there any real benefit for the user that they are not interoperable?

Saying wouldn't it be nice without proposing how such a scheme would work without picking winners and losers is naive. The devil is in the details as they say.

Ubitiquious cross platform apps, sure! Just 3x your development team size - will your app still make sense to make with those costs? Oh don't worry - just replatform to a cross platform toolkit (and stop working on new features for 6-12months and retrain the entire team).

I just don't see why it's worth bringing the blunt hammer of government intervention here - let alone a reasonable path for regulation implementation.

Re: Ask HN: Tips for Reducing the Number of Inboxes

#83

Post by sdfhbdf »

jhylands wrote: post #18
Tmpod wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Worth mentioning: https://www.beeper.com/ Essentially a Matrix-powered service focused on bringing a ton of inboxes. I've heard it's great, but never tried it myself.

Not currently open to sign up. :( I’ve joined the queue to get an account though

I joined the queue over a year ago and have yet to receive any communication about signing up.

Re: Ask HN: Tips for Reducing the Number of Inboxes

#84

Post by t-3 »

albertzeyer wrote: post #19

The EU is planning to require big online messaging services to be interoperable. https://www.theverge.com/2022/3/24/22995431/european-union-d... This would solve it. Then you could simply use a single app. This is a political thing. So, vote for it, talk to the politicians.

Wouldn't that basically set protocols in stone and block any future improvement or research? Standards are generally good, but I can't see legally mandated protocols as anything but guaranteed ossification.

Re: Ask HN: Tips for Reducing the Number of Inboxes

#85

Post by t-3 »

endisneigh wrote: post #72
capableweb wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It’s funny you mention browsers because there are a ton of sites and features that only work on chrome and not safari. Is that because Safari doesn't implement everything decided by the standards bodies or because Chrome deploys their own features? Probably a mix of both, but eventually there is a convergence. Things work surprisingly well in modern times. I'm not sure when you started using the web, but back in th…

My point is that email basically hasn't evolved meaningfully from the 80s and other than the main feature of sending text all of the functionality is locked between specific providers. Tags vs. folders vs. labels, chat without email, encryption, etc. Nothing other than the baseline functionality is standardized.

Nothing other than baseline functionality should be standardized. Client features are totally irrelevant to the goal of sending and receiving messages.

Re: Ask HN: Tips for Reducing the Number of Inboxes

#86

Post by dingleberry420 »

endisneigh wrote: post #37
dingleberry420 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why should this be an issue at all? It's my account, I should know the encryption key & algorithm. Any open source app can then implement this.

How exactly would you implement an interoperable E2EE group chat app where you can arbitrarily add and remove people like with iMessage? The EU law linked does not actually recommend anything specifically, just vaguely states interoperability being a goal. Certain apps will have certain functionality. Unless you're willing to constrain the functionality it's not really possible. Right now everyone could already use e…

The same way as they're doing it right now, just well-documented and open. Let the bigcrops create working groups to hammer out the details.

Re: Ask HN: Tips for Reducing the Number of Inboxes

#87

Post by dingleberry420 »

bhawks wrote: post #77
loudmax wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Politicians shouldn't be in charge of defining interoperability standards. But politicians can mandate that companies be interoperable. Regulation is hard. This doesn't mean that rules shouldn't exist.

Just because they can doesn't mean they should. Should they mandate that video game platforms be interoperable? What about mandating that every company produces apps that interoperate with windows Mac Linux and mobile.

It'd be more likely they'd mandate Mac, Linux and Mobile to all support a common app format. Which they already kind of do, the web.
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