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Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

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Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#81

Post by ldiracdelta »

hliyan wrote: post #42

I had a similar problem where the the bigger / the more complex the task in front of me was, the more my brain resisted to getting started and the more i procrasitnated. I came up with a fundamentally "agile" solution: break the problems down into smaller tasks until the first task is too small to offer resistance. E.g. rather than "write architecture specification", start with "outline the heads for architecture spe…

I had a similar issue and the fix for me was the system "Getting Things Done". The biggest paradigm change from it was, "You can't work on projects. You can only work on actions related to projects."

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#82

Post by dvcrn »

kharak wrote: post #70
hsartoris wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fellow ADHD sufferer here to second this. Thinking about ADHD as a deficit of motivation, which is much more accurate than an attention-oriented view, tends to clarify this sort of situation.

I have trouble focusing on work most of the time and lack the motivation for almost everything, unless not doing it would cause problems. But everything I've read about ADHD doesn't sound like a me at all. Never heard of your way of describing it though.

I just posted a comment below that sounds like that - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22920256

Adhd feels like knowing how to do something and knowing you should do it, but not actually doing it. It’s like your inner drive is very weak unless there is an external consequence involved, like a deadline.

Dumb examples are

- your homework unless the deadline comes closer

- a amazon box that you know the contents of but currently don’t need it, so it stays packaged standing around until you need the item or the space

- dishes

- a todo list item that’s floating around for weeks that takes minutes to complete but has no deadline

Then at other moments something just grabs your attention and it becomes the most important thing right now even if you should be doing something else. Like finding a new tool or programming language that you really want to use immediately, or randomly cleaning your entrance area NOW even though you should be leaving for the train to make a meeting.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#83

Post by ExtremisAndy »

dvcrn wrote: post #59
hsartoris wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fellow ADHD sufferer here to second this. Thinking about ADHD as a deficit of motivation, which is much more accurate than an attention-oriented view, tends to clarify this sort of situation.

Giving a third +1 here. I had (have) similar issues with motivation and got diagnosed with ADHD at age 25. I'd describe it as "a disability of knowing how to do something, but not actually doing it unless there are external consequences involved"

Oh wow... you just described me with frightening accuracy. I’ve never seen my issue described so clearly and concisely. Basically, if there aren’t negative consequences for me not completing a task, my brain simply never gets motivated. It’s almost as if my brain is saying: “meh... you don’t really have to do this... so go play on Facebook some more”. If I could resolve this issue which has plagued me for years, it would revolutionize my life and career.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#84

Post by koheripbal »

WheelsAtLarge wrote: post #72
hliyan wrote: post #42

I had a similar problem where the the bigger / the more complex the task in front of me was, the more my brain resisted to getting started and the more i procrasitnated. I came up with a fundamentally "agile" solution: break the problems down into smaller tasks until the first task is too small to offer resistance. E.g. rather than "write architecture specification", start with "outline the heads for architecture spe…

Very good advice, additionally, I would build habits that help you get things accomplished. For example, get up early every day, get ready and go directly to an area where the only thing you do is work on your tasks and you force yourself to accomplish at least a task while you are there. It's amazing how your point of view changes once you don't have to think about what you will do next and when you will do it. “Eig…

For me, the #1 thing was not going out drinking. I used to go out and consume alcohol 3-4 times per week and I had no idea what an energy drain it was until I stopped.

It's been a whole new world since then.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#85

Post by thatsenough »

dvcrn wrote: post #59
hsartoris wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fellow ADHD sufferer here to second this. Thinking about ADHD as a deficit of motivation, which is much more accurate than an attention-oriented view, tends to clarify this sort of situation.

Giving a third +1 here. I had (have) similar issues with motivation and got diagnosed with ADHD at age 25. I'd describe it as "a disability of knowing how to do something, but not actually doing it unless there are external consequences involved"

How do you differentiate this from laziness/apathy?

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#86

Post by p2t2p »

hliyan wrote: post #42

I had a similar problem where the the bigger / the more complex the task in front of me was, the more my brain resisted to getting started and the more i procrasitnated. I came up with a fundamentally "agile" solution: break the problems down into smaller tasks until the first task is too small to offer resistance. E.g. rather than "write architecture specification", start with "outline the heads for architecture spe…

Same. I open my favorite moleskin A4 5mm graph notebook (graph paper is the only correct paper for notebooks btw), which is a treat to write on, I grab my favorite pen and start listing the tiniest, smallest steps I can make towards the solution.

Like "Open IDE and two terminals and point terminals to correct branch".

First, I enjoy the process - moleskin + favorite pen. Second, my brain started to think about the task. Third, I starting to get into flow state". Usually I jot down like a dozen of those steps or so and I'm pretty deep in the flow by then.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#87

Post by ndynan »

exabrial wrote: post #2

For some people, procrastination is a form of emotional management. For others, sometimes the best strategy is "embrace the suck": do it even though you're likely to fail. Keep repeating until you don't. Having a good well rounded education or library of random facts helps you dig into problems because it gives you perspective. Learning should be a lifelong process. Finally, physical health is very important. If you'…

Just wanted to add 2 cents to this comments and the rest of the comments in this thread. Lots of good stuff here on ADHD, trauma-orientation, and emotional management.

To build on this thread, I think it's important to feel what is happening when you procrastinate. What is it like in your body when you think about your task. Is it because you think you are going to fail? Because the task involves interpersonal conflict? Is it because you just don't want to do it (not interesting).

If you can start w/ your body + emotions, you'll get a felt sense of what is standing in the way. From there you can start to ask the question "why", is there a reason that those types of emotions happen when faced with this type of task?

As someone with ADHD, anticipatory anxiety has stopped me in my tracks countless times. I try to use this method to be aware there is anxiety, the feelings, and the story I'm telling around that anxiety. For me the anxiety is often a way of not starting, and if I don't start I can't mess up. In recognizing that, I can be a little bit more supportive of myself and be more willing to try.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#88

Post by h0l0cube »

biswaroop wrote: post #11

This could be because you were told you're a smart kid. Kids who are praised for intelligence over effort have been shown in some studies to pick easier problems and give up quickly if a problem is too hard. Check out Carol Dweck's research. Here's an early article: [ https://www.nytimes.com/1998/07/14/science/praise-children-f... ]. Note that there are some criticisms of her work, and like many other studies in psyc…

There was an article[0] on HN a couple of days ago about 'accelerated' education for gifted students, and how 'nonaccelerands' appears to have significantly worse outcomes. I suspect that students who are the best in their class can reliably put less effort for the same result as their peers, and then learn to 'coast' their way through life. Until they reach college-level, or the 'real world', where the workload often doesn't permit this.

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22901962

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#89

Post by jungletime »

The problem is that you can fail if you try. And failing at anything is a scary thing. So its easier not to try. And there's comfort in mediocrity. And your brain will reward it.

The trick is that you should accept failure as part of the process, a necessity.

Most people will get catch a cold or flue during the year, and so is with mental health. Don't expect not get down at some points.

But you should always treat yourself as someone you want to help. To that end, take a meta view of yourself.

Here are some tips:

1) Look into personality types, and figure out which one you score high at. Use it as guide. Nothing is definitive, but could provide you some insight into why you behave the way you do.

2) Fresh air and exercise is important. Spend at least an hour outside every day, walk or whatever. How long you can walk, is actually a very good indicator of your health, and life expectancy.

3) Try Yoga, the really good programs, combine movement with breath, and even a bit of meditation. It will improve mental clarity, and help with flexibility. Like this one. http://katepotteryoga.ca/namaste-tv-show/

4) Good dental hygiene. Bad Gums can cause serious inflammation, and health issues. Make sure you fix any teeth problems quickly. And don't smoke.

5) Good sleep hygiene. Black out windows a night, and make sure you are get fresh air into the room. C02 levels can build up in your room during the night. And make sure if you snore, to get medical help with it.

6) Realize that you soon will be dead. And many greater, smarter people than us, have lived this life before. Read or Listen to books they wrote. It will often contain their best insights summarized.

Like for example some stoic philosophy, which is great at helping visualize the worse case scenario, and accept it. Marcus Aurelius is great. This is a fun series.

"The philosopher's guide to happiness" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVA8jX9KQcE&list=PL785793324...

7) Make Future plans, and daily to do lists. The process of writing things down, focuses you on what you need to get done. It really does help. Seize the day!

8) 25 minute timer, 5 minute breaks.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#90

Post by Freeboots »

jimmysong wrote: post #35

I'm going to guess that you're going to get more mileage out of cutting something out of your life than in adopting yet another mindset, habit, drug or whatever. Some possible things that might work: * youtube/netflix * social media * news * sugar * video games These are the things your brain goes towards automatically as an easier "win" than in facing the harder problem. Cutting them out will leave room for you to f…

Do you think this would have the same effect on someone who had a legitimate underlying issue (eg adhd)?

I just ask because its the standard response along with sleep and exercise, and I cant help wonder if it "works" because people without real underlying issues get some marginal benefit, or if it actually works for people with issues.

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