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Ask HN: How was life for a regular dev during the dot com burst?

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Re: Ask HN: How was life for a regular dev during the dot com burst?

#81
In bad times, the correlation of bad things rises a lot, just like so many fund managers have discovered the hard way.

In 2001, seeing what was coming, I left a Linux distro startup and went back to a previous and seemingly secure IT job. I even had plans to take aircraft lessons...

Then, the owner sold the company. The buyers were actually "locusts" - people that offer to buy struggling businesses just to hollow out the assets and then hand the company back ("we saw too many problems, so we are no longer interested").

Back to a market that was fully depressed, had to take a project involving gambling machines (I think they are called "one-armed bandits" in English). It was a technically interesting project, but the people involved in this business are unbearable. After some months into it, I trembled every time the phone rang. After I finally quit, it took 6 years to fully recover from anxiety and depression.

Re: Ask HN: How was life for a regular dev during the dot com burst?

#82
post #61

I graduated from college right amidst the bubble bursting, and it was brutal. Fresh college grads and junior developers were competing with displaced veterans for entry-level positions. ~1 year prior I had been offered $120k/yr to drop out of school and move to Pittsburgh to take a job. I decided to stay in school to finish my degree instead, and by the time I did the bottom of the market had fallen out and I was une…

Did you look into the history of the Pittsburgh company? My guess is you did the right thing, in a year you could have been in a strange city looking for a job with no degree.

I did. It eventually folded, but the people I knew that worked there managed to go into some pretty impressive gigs. One ended up as a VP at Apple on the iTunes Music Store side of things, if I recall correctly.

It's hard to say how things would have worked out otherwise, but I'm not living on that git branch in the repository of life, and I fear what it would take to resolve the merge conflicts, so I just chug away on the feature branch I'm currently on until the whole lot of it is deprecated. There are two nascent forks running around here that I think show promise.

Re: Ask HN: How was life for a regular dev during the dot com burst?

#83
post #9

Life is what you make it. I chose to remain independent for my career. Both 2000 and 2007 came and went and unless someone told me, I wouldn't know we were in a recession or stock market crash. Perhaps I missed out on a few opportunities but I never really wanted to trade my freedom for the chance of money. If you have a good network and do quality work, you will be in demand regardless of the market. There will neve…

How to you make a transition to this way of working? Is it all about networking?

Re: Ask HN: How was life for a regular dev during the dot com burst?

#84
post #75

I stupidly left college to join a dot com for all kinds of fun things like a huge salary, bonuses, dual monitors, my own office space, a big cool office building. Then, after about 6 months, the company funding our company just pulled out. Left us with a few bucks in the bank. I took another dot com job about 400 miles away and got out of there. Lots of people there had no jobs after that, but a few of the smarter cr…

Could you elaborate on the similarities?

Re: Ask HN: How was life for a regular dev during the dot com burst?

#85

In November 2000 my options were worth $2.4m on paper but they did not start vesting until January. In January they were worth -$1.5m and never exceeded the strike price again, at a company that is still public and worth > 10 billion today. They laid me off in february. I got healthy in 2 months and found a small startup with a 15% paycut but the CEO was a WeWork-level crook with a jet and he absconded with all the m…

I don’t know how stock options work. If you’re laid off do you no longer have access to them?

Re: Ask HN: How was life for a regular dev during the dot com burst?

#86
I worked at a company called Hydrogen Media in St Pete, Florida. We had a bell that would ring only when we got a million dollar deal. It rang multiple times a day.

Our office was insane. Exposed rafters with the trusses and everything painted black. Our walls were deep blue but had blue neon running the length of the room on all sides. No overhead lighting.

Our developer floor was elevated with sub-floor network cabling. We had a dev floor about 100 yards by 50 yards, the size of a football field, roughly. A little shy of that. Private offices had glass walls facing the dev floor. Our sound studio (these were the flash days) was a hollowed-out VW bus in a soundproofed room.

We had a fire pole from the bosses office down to the dev room, conference tables with in-layed TVs. It was pretty wild.

In my time there, I built ~400 replicated sites for Colliers realty, DuPont Registry's website, a bunch of websites for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, the Tampa Bay Lightning's website among others. We were printing money.

The crash hit hard, and Hydrogen Media dwindled. Massive layoffs, and eventually it renamed to Bayshore Solutions and relocated to Tampa where they still do business to this day.

Re: Ask HN: How was life for a regular dev during the dot com burst?

#88
I was working at a startup that had SF and Mountain View offices at the time of 9/11. SF offices for tech companies were somewhat unusual then, though a lot were under construction. Most companies still had their main HQ somewhere on the peninsula. Although the tech decline had started before 9/11, it really seemed to pick up speed after that. I remember one of the company execs talking about the next round of funding and basically saying investors were "holed up in their bunkers" - that is, not funding anything. I did know (talented!) programmers that lost their jobs - one even collected unemployment for a time. In early 2002, the company I was at closed the SF office, and then I was also unemployed.

After a few months, I found a replacement job at a non-startup in South San Francisco. The pay was OK but work was a bit dull. After a couple of years I moved out and haven't been been back except to visit. Spent a total of 6 years living in SF and working around the area, from 1998 to 2004. While there, I saved very little money and also never made anything from stock options. When I left I had about about 30K in my 401K account and 20K in savings. Hopefully startup compensation is better today. I know the rents are still insane.

I'd say from a programmer perspective the 2000 bubble bursting was bad but not catastrophic. If we are now in a new bubble, I hope it won't be too bad if it bursts. But the industry employs way more people now and is much more fundamental to the overall economy. So there is cause for concern...if suddenly 10s of thousands of programmers are out looking for work, that ain't gonna be pretty.

Re: Ask HN: How was life for a regular dev during the dot com burst?

#89
> what to expect if such a thing were to happen again

Expect to be unemployed. If don't think there will be a stretch of time in your future where you won't be unemployed for a while, think again. Have a backup plan. Have savings. Move in with the parents and bus tables, try a different field you have a little experience in, keep in touch with people. It's a lot less scary if you're prepared than if you wait and see.

Re: Ask HN: How was life for a regular dev during the dot com burst?

#90
I was at a dotcom that busted (after going public). Developers were laid off left and right. But the internet economy hadnt taken hold yet and the tech companies were mainly still old school shrink wrapped software.

i started my own company at that time and there were a ton of developers desperate for work.

Because of the huge internet companies that are voraciously hiring and that have huge warchests, I think it will be different next time around.

I can see IT at non tech companies getting laid off and having trouble finding work.

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