Ask HN: Is the market bad, or am I having the worst luck job hunting? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: Is the market bad, or am I having the worst luck job hunting?

#711

Post by solarmist » Fri, Jul 28, 2023, 2:53 PM UTC

herbst wrote: post #335

jameshush wrote: post #46

Reach out to people you've worked with in the past. After having five years of experience, you should have worked with at least a handful of people who need someone to fix another broken website. These could be managers, people on your team, people on OTHER teams, vendors, salespeople you've spoken to, anyone. Ideally, you should ALWAYS keep in contact with people you've worked with, even if it's just emailing them "…

I would be totally weird out if some of my past co-workers suddenly reaches out to me with bullshit smalltalk to ask for a job. Or random people from my past sending me happy birthday ever year. I am probably not social enough to understand that, but that sounds like a lot of work just to stand out as kinda weird.

It's about showing that you care about the person, not JUST what they can do for you, your job search, or your career.

People don't like feeling like a tool other people use to get what they want.

Or do you mean reaching out at all for a referral? This is simply because HR and managers love knowing that someone, ANYONE, likes you enough to be willing to work with you again.

Re: Ask HN: Is the market bad, or am I having the worst luck job hunting?

#712

Post by hunterhod » Fri, Jul 28, 2023, 2:54 PM UTC

MentallyRetired wrote: post #652

noodle wrote: post #602

As someone on the other side, with open positions we're hiring for: There are probably fewer job openings than there were, but I don't think my company or anyone in my network have changed HOW they're hiring, but we have definitely noticed a huge uptick in volume of applications. Earlier in the year, we were getting almost nothing. Now we're getting hundreds of resumes a week for each open position, and the bulk of e…

I think this tech downturn is all a collusion amongst tech leaders to bring down software developer salaries. How are so many places hiring yet so many are laying off thousands, and most of them in tech/development? Even the places laying people off are still hiring those positions.

How would such a joint-coordinated effort work? Is such collusion possible at this scale?

Re: Ask HN: Is the market bad, or am I having the worst luck job hunting?

#713

Post by throwaway2037 » Fri, Jul 28, 2023, 2:54 PM UTC

WinLychee wrote: post #582

neon_electro wrote: post #559

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I've started grinding leetcode, reviewing system design, and behavioral questions. You MUST memorize perfect responses to regurgitate as fast as possible on the interview. I have been diagnosed with ADHD (and started medication, to be clear) this year. How do I best tell prospective employers I might need some accommodation in this process? I've been at it on and off for 17 months and have had the worst experience…

I hate to say it, but you're gonna have to learn coping mechanisms. I think a lot of us in tech have similar issues to be honest, so you're not alone here. Personally I HATE having to sit there and grind, but you've got to find a way to squeeze out the motivation. I also perform really poorly under interview pressure, but I think that wildly over-preparing can help you calm your nerves. Personal network is also SUPER…

    wildly over-preparing can help you calm your nerves

This is exactly what (ballet) dancers and (classical/jazz) muscians do. It is hard enough to do what they do without pressure of hundreds of people paying money to watch you.

Also, other HN posts about pressure in interviews have given two amazing ideas:

1) Take a mild beta-blocker before the interview. Any liberal doctor will prescribe without issue. "Practice" a few times before the real thing so that you can find a level that works for you. This kind of drug is used to cheat in concetration sports like archery and darts.

2) If remote interview, drink a (half) glass of white wine (don't stain your teeth!) before or during your interview. You can hide it in a mug. More than a few people have vouched for this idea.

Re: Ask HN: Is the market bad, or am I having the worst luck job hunting?

#714

Post by wing-_-nuts » Fri, Jul 28, 2023, 2:55 PM UTC

ghotli wrote: post #623

neon_electro wrote: post #559

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I've started grinding leetcode, reviewing system design, and behavioral questions. You MUST memorize perfect responses to regurgitate as fast as possible on the interview. I have been diagnosed with ADHD (and started medication, to be clear) this year. How do I best tell prospective employers I might need some accommodation in this process? I've been at it on and off for 17 months and have had the worst experience…

I skimmed this earlier and this comment got stuck in my mind. I came back to others saying similar things but I'm still commenting anyway. The thing you're asking for? There is no such thing. I've been in your shoes and I've been on both sides of the interview table many times. You probably need to drop the idea that there will be accomodations for anything during this sort of process. Let me tell you what works for…

As someone with ADHD and cerebral palsy, I will say at least physical accommodations are sometimes respected. I only ask to be allowed to remain seated while whiteboarding. Sometimes it's flat out ignored. Once I was asked to whiteboard in front of a panel of judges for an hour. After that experience, I'm now much more assertive about it, which can lead me to be viewed as abrasive. Thankfully it's a non issue since most interviews moved online. My current boss didn't even know I had a disability until we met for lunch 3mo later.

I don't ask for accommodation for ADHD. I believe that would be judged far more harshly. Frankly, the ability to focus is part of the job requirement. If I were having issues with this I would get medicated before asking for accommodation.

Re: Ask HN: Is the market bad, or am I having the worst luck job hunting?

#715

Post by jimbokun » Fri, Jul 28, 2023, 2:56 PM UTC

WinLychee wrote: post #670

evantbyrne wrote: post #657

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I've started grinding leetcode, reviewing system design, and behavioral questions. You MUST memorize perfect responses to regurgitate as fast as possible on the interview. Again, you cannot afford a single mistake in process right now or they will pass on you. I'm not discounting that it is hard to find tech jobs right now, but have you considered that this attitude of "grinding leetcode" is possibly contributing t…

No, the first round is usually a timed coding interview where the goal is to get an optimal solution as fast as possible. You should not be talking much with the interviewer. The intro (if there is one) is a quick exchange of names and last job worked at, then immediately diving into coding problem. You cannot start with a naive solution, interviewer will ask you to skip and go straight to optimal (this happened to m…

This would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

When people started asking these questions, the whole point was to see how people reason about a new problem they haven't solved before. There are almost no work problems that require you to regurgitate something verbatim you saw on leetcode before.

It's seriously making me question the intelligence of these interviewers. Although at the same time I realize it's mainly just to arbitrarily whittle down the applicant pool to a smaller number you can interview in person.

Re: Ask HN: Is the market bad, or am I having the worst luck job hunting?

#716

Post by wing-_-nuts » Fri, Jul 28, 2023, 2:58 PM UTC

eric_cc wrote: post #595

neon_electro wrote: post #559

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I've started grinding leetcode, reviewing system design, and behavioral questions. You MUST memorize perfect responses to regurgitate as fast as possible on the interview. I have been diagnosed with ADHD (and started medication, to be clear) this year. How do I best tell prospective employers I might need some accommodation in this process? I've been at it on and off for 17 months and have had the worst experience…

> 10 year career veteran A 10 year career does not make you a veteran..

Lol, ok. I don't even bother to list anything on my resume over 10 years old.

Re: Ask HN: Is the market bad, or am I having the worst luck job hunting?

#717

Post by fnimick » Fri, Jul 28, 2023, 2:59 PM UTC

polishdude20 wrote: post #702

jorts wrote: post #656

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More like everyone realized that they can trim down to improve margins without taking a lot of flack.

Yep, fire the devs after they've built the software. Fire them because the software is already built. Slowly your software grinds to a halt and dies because you release features too slow or your software starts to become very bad.

By the time that happens the person who gets to tout the savings on their resume has already leveraged that for a salary bump somewhere else.

It's an unfortunate reality that if you're employed (not a founder) and you think more than a year or so out, you are going to be outcompeted by people who optimize for short term gain and leave before the bill comes due.

Re: Ask HN: Is the market bad, or am I having the worst luck job hunting?

#718

Post by alanpage » Fri, Jul 28, 2023, 2:59 PM UTC

If you must apply via online job applications, definitely change your resume to include as many of the keywords in the job description as you can, while still being truthful. If you don't, the first-level automated filtering will screen you out of the group moving on to the HR department. This is a huge amount of work, but even a little bit of an edge can help.

That said, DON'T go through online applications if you can avoid it. Many of the jobs I (and others around me) have gotten are through their personal network.

Develop your personal network now. Question: When is the best time to plant a tree if you want to enjoy it? Answer: 20 years ago. When is the second best time to plant a tree? Today.

1. Connect to everyone you know personally or have ever worked with on LinkedIn, and use the "Send a note" function to give them a reason to remember you, and say you'd like to add them to your network. Once you've got a decent number of connections (at least a few hundred?), post a "looking for work" type of message with your skills, experience, and interests. Be sincere and not "network-y". Do it with the intention that they might be able to help you now, but you may be able to help them in the future.

2. Reach out to friends and coworkers that you had a closer relationship with, and let them know that you're looking for work in a particular area or field, and do they know of anything available (or companies that fit your area). Friends and ex-coworkers are the best because they can get you right into the HR department or the hiring manager.

3. Do not discount the many people on LinkedIn who currently or recently worked at a company that you are considering applying to (but that you don't know). Sign up for the paid LinkedIn service for a month, and use the ability of paid users to email anyone, to reach out to people who might be in the department of the company that you are looking at. You'd be amazed what information or help you can get from total strangers, just by sending them a nice note explaining that you're looking at the company/department and would like to speak to them for a few minutes to get an idea of the company culture. This is scary for many people (a younger myself included), but I've done it and it works. Most people will give you a few minutes to talk to you. And you could get valuable information about the team/department/manager, that could help you present the side of you that works best in their culture (laid back, hard-charging, early-risers, dog-friendly, tabs not spaces, etc.).

Good luck with the search!

Re: Ask HN: Is the market bad, or am I having the worst luck job hunting?

#719

Post by neon_electro » Fri, Jul 28, 2023, 2:59 PM UTC

wing-_-nuts wrote: post #714

ghotli wrote: post #623

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I skimmed this earlier and this comment got stuck in my mind. I came back to others saying similar things but I'm still commenting anyway. The thing you're asking for? There is no such thing. I've been in your shoes and I've been on both sides of the interview table many times. You probably need to drop the idea that there will be accomodations for anything during this sort of process. Let me tell you what works for…

As someone with ADHD and cerebral palsy, I will say at least physical accommodations are sometimes respected. I only ask to be allowed to remain seated while whiteboarding. Sometimes it's flat out ignored. Once I was asked to whiteboard in front of a panel of judges for an hour . After that experience, I'm now much more assertive about it, which can lead me to be viewed as abrasive. Thankfully it's a non issue since…

Thanks for your thoughts. I am medicated.

Re: Ask HN: Is the market bad, or am I having the worst luck job hunting?

#720

Post by solarmist » Fri, Jul 28, 2023, 2:59 PM UTC

laichzeit0 wrote: post #380

herbst wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would be totally weird out if some of my past co-workers suddenly reaches out to me with bullshit smalltalk to ask for a job. Or random people from my past sending me happy birthday ever year. I am probably not social enough to understand that, but that sounds like a lot of work just to stand out as kinda weird.

Yeah this is weird. Work is not just a place where you transact time/utility for money. You can also get to know people and form friendships. I still regularly chat with past work colleagues and meet up with them when I travel. In the last 20 years I’ve interviewed for exactly one job, and that was my first one out of university. Since then it’s always been people I know offering me new positions. People don’t just h…

>I’ve interviewed for exactly one job

I hear this every so often, but do you mean that literally? It's so far outside my reality I can't believe it still happens.

I've never seen anyone get a job at an established company without SOME kind of interview. Even Guido van Rossum (creator of Python) has needed to do some interviews when changing companies.

Even if they are the hiring manager at a new company I've never seen them be able to completely bypass the HR process in that way.