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Ask HN: What does one look for in a laptop these days?

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Re: Ask HN: What does one look for in a laptop these days?

#711

Post by mixmastamyk »

BozeWolf wrote: post #459
Underphil wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like so many people, I love the hardware but hate the software. Hoping that once Linux is solid on there, I'll be able to get one.

I was in the same boat around 2012. After 11 years of linux on the desktop and crappy student laptop, I needed a proper laptop for freelance jobs. Bought a macbook to put linux on. Ruined macos on day one. Reinstalled macos. Got used to it. Loved that all the hardware and software just works. Never installed ubuntu desktop again. Would like to use linux again on the desktop, but macos is so nicely integrated with eve…

"Better to die on your feet than to live on your knees."

A reference to the freedom from corporate bondage you trade away for convenience in macos.

(I don't have any significant issues with Ubuntu Mate, but I don't use it for many things however.)

Re: Ask HN: What does one look for in a laptop these days?

#712

Post by hoistbypetard »

dorfsmay wrote: post #651
hoistbypetard wrote: post #618

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you ever used a trackpoint-style pointing device from anyone other than IBM or Lenovo and had it be any good? I think the current Lenovo trackpoints aren't as good as the IBM devices used to be in the late 1990s. I assume they were sacrificed on the same altar as the keyboards. But the ones I've used from Dell, Toshiba and HP were so aggressively terrible I'd rather just carry around an external mouse. So I like…

I have used some of them. Indeed not as good but useable. Sadly Lenovo is taking alot of wrong directions imo, non-removeable battery, soldering memory now etc... I'd be happy to try something else and love the concepts behind the Framework.

Lenovo's descent into soldered RAM and the elimination of external batteries has me rooting for Framework too.

My daily driver is currently a T-480 that's about 3.5 years old. The relative stagnation of CPU and even IO in laptops has it still feeling reasonable to use. I'm hoping that by the time I want to replace it, Framework will really have found their stride and my decision will be obvious.

And I'd rather be stuck with a touchpad than a soldered SSD, which feels like Lenovo's next logical move.

Re: Ask HN: What does one look for in a laptop these days?

#713

Post by cma »

manmal wrote: post #701
cma wrote: post #647

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Beefier graphics often improves battery life (more cores at lower clock, like nvidia mobile vs desktop for the same model number: lower TDP, same perf). They might move to more power hungry RAM as part of it though.

The on-chip GPU Apple ships in their MBPs draws way less power than the dedicated Nvidia chip. This is especially noticeable in the battery life drop that occurs when the dedicated chip is used exclusively.

On chip/package has many power advantages, and Apple is on a much newer process node with M1 (TSMC 5nm).

The point I was making was that e.g. a GTX 2070 desktop has around the same compute power as the mobile version, but the mobile version uses much less power. It does this by being beefier (2560 CUDA cores mobile 2070, 2304 CUDA cores desktop 2070), but running at a lower clock.

Re: Ask HN: What does one look for in a laptop these days?

#714

Post by smoldesu »

walterbell wrote: post #683
nightpool wrote: post #544

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait, are you saying that if you set up FileVault to not use your iCloud account, Apple still holds a master key? I thought that was the whole point of using your own recovery key

Seconding this question! 2017 article says Apple doesn't have a copy without iCloud enabled, https://www.macworld.com/article/229963/want-to-recover-a-fi...

I can't respond in good faith without access to the source code. Everything that I would tell you is just conjecture based on either trust or hatred of Apple, which is equally useless to the consumer. Use your best judgement.

Re: Ask HN: What does one look for in a laptop these days?

#715

Post by ayushnix »

mixmastamyk wrote: post #707
ayushnix wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I did look into the Framework laptop recently but while it's probably the closet things in a long time the keyboard doesn't look good and there's no trackpoint (nor even physical mouse buttons) It also has a screen that needs fractional scaling which makes Framework a deal breaker for me, no second thoughts about it. I'm not buying anything with a fractionally scaled display if I can help it.

200dpi according to calculator, which is about right for 2x. What would you prefer? 2256x1504, 13.5” https://www.calculators.tech/dpi-calculator#dpi-viewing-dist... Says it is good from about three feet away.

200dpi on a laptop screen would ideally need 1.6x scaling, not 2x. It could vary between 1.4x to 1.8x but definitely not 2x. Not sure what's wrong with that website.

At 13.5 inches, it would've been better to take a page from some Surface laptops and go for 3000x2000 or 3200x1800, depending on the preference for aspect ratio. At ~260 PPI, 2x scaling works fine.

Re: Ask HN: What does one look for in a laptop these days?

#716

Post by drdec »

jillesvangurp wrote: post #128

- decent design; no gamer laptops, blinking led monstrosities, etc. for me. - decent performance; I'm an engineer. I actually lose time when things run slowly. Lots of time. Kills my flow and I bill a premium rate. - decent screen. I look at this thing for the better part of a day. Also, I dabble with photography once in a while and occasionally some frontend stuff. So, HDPI/250 dpi or better. - Decent ssd storage. I…

Sounds great, so what brand and model are you using now?

Re: Ask HN: What does one look for in a laptop these days?

#717

Post by fomine3 »

smoldesu wrote: post #564
NobodyNada wrote: post #490

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s true that ARM alone isn’t the reason for the M1’s performance, but it’s definitely a significant factor. x86 is old — modern x86 chips are still backwards-compatible with the original 8086 from 1978 — and it’s stuck with plenty of design decisions that might have been the correct choice sometime within the past 45 years but no longer today. Whereas the M1 only implements AArch64, a complete redesign of the ARM a…

The issue for me is that ARM is also really old now. I mean, just look at the ISA Apple has to use to run their MacOS on it: it's littered with NEON extensions and more cruft than you can shake a stick at. Simply put, Apple's implementation of ARM is decidedly CISC. On top of this, I'm still dumbfounded by the fact that they didn't go for a chiplet design where ARM could truly shine: if Apple had went the chiplet rou…

> On top of this, I'm still dumbfounded by the fact that they didn't go for a chiplet design where ARM could truly shine: if Apple had went the chiplet route, the M1 could have had a much higher IO ceiling and might have a shot at addressing more than 16 gigs of RAM.

Remember that M1 is just a mobile SoC that work for iPad/MacBook Air. It's exceptionally great so people tend to confuse M1 is targeted higher end. 16GB max is fine for a mobile SoC in 2021. I can't wait M1X.

Re: Ask HN: What does one look for in a laptop these days?

#718

Post by harry8 »

meragrin_ wrote: post #219
hnfong wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like the GP summarized what you quoted perfectly. Not sure about user expectations but it’s the first time I heard about laptops overheating in standby mode.

> Close the lid without full shutdown, warranty voided bad. That does not convey "placed in a bag, backpack, or in an overhead bin" in any way.

The difference between a laptop and a "portable desktop" is you close the lid of a laptop and put it in your laptop bag, stand up and leave. Be it from the plane, train, cafe, or anywhere else you please.

If a computer cannot simply have its lid closed before being placed in its bag it simply is /not/ a laptop. It should not be advertised as a laptop and it should have a big f&%ing warning on it telling you that it will break if you treat it the way you expect to treat a laptop.

Either Dell didn't know they messed up their laptop design and when they found out made the decision not to recall the faulty product or they knew and sold it fraudulently. "This is a laptop - but we know it isn't and will break if you treat it like one warranty void, sucks if you believed us."

Either way Dell made the decision to screw their customers. There's no getting around that. It's a choice they made.

Re: Ask HN: What does one look for in a laptop these days?

#719

Post by godDLL »

godDLL wrote: post #115

OP here: so, from the amount of comments I surmise that my like-minded crowd is either not hanging around here no more, or aren't really numerous. Thanks everyone for participating in this discussion, I appreciate you all.

UPDATE: in the two days this was up, having combed through the comments on three separate occasions – the following seems to be the general consensus, in rough order of relative importance:

1. S3 standby/sleep support required

2. low weight for luggability, 2.5lb maximum

3. survives table-to-floor falls

4. always-on-AC battery deaths unacceptible

5. survives being in a bag, accidental activation

6. Linux support for all hardware

7. trackpads on par with Apple, at least

8. keyboards with clear actuation, spill resistance and backlighting

9. kill switches or modular hardware for camera and mic

10. bright matte screens, with vertical space

11. memory and I/O performance approaching Apple's M1 SoC

12. HDMI, USB-A, 3.5mm, 10gbE, SD, USB-C periferals are what people own, support that

13. trackpoints are great for text-editing

14. quiet operation, no blinken-lights

15. prefer no webcam over shitty webcam, no BT/WiFi over shitty BT/WiFi

After the Apple event streams I shall post a list of laptops people seem to have a history of enjoying.

Cheers.

Re: Ask HN: What does one look for in a laptop these days?

#720

Post by danicriss »

Smithalicious wrote: post #166

0. Linux compatibility, I am not super picky about getting everything to work perfectly but I should be able to trust that the software I prefer to use will run and my laptop will connect to wifi and play audio properly and so on. 1. IPS screen (mostly a given nowadays, but this wasn't always so) 2. Trackpoint, I hate trackpads. Pretty rare option so I could possibly be convinced otherwise if the trackpad is particul…

I see a lot of mentions of mainstream brands in this thread. If Linux compatibility is a criterion, why not a laptop built with that in mind?

Just a reminder that now exist, in no particular order: - Juno Computers - Tuxedo Computers - System76 - Slimbook - Starlabs - Pine - Framework - Manjaro Computers

Admittedly, the same chassis are reused across a couple of these examples, but there's choice

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