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Ask HN: Aren't you afraid of a possible world conflict?

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Re: Ask HN: Aren't you afraid of a possible world conflict?

#71

Post by mnky9800n »

euroderf wrote: post #22
mnky9800n wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't matter what Russia is fighting with. The war is not about winning, it is about war profiteering. Both for Putin and the West. While the West gives out fat new contracts to build new weapons, Putin has stolen much of the grain produced in Ukraine and launders it through ship to ship transfers then sells to Egypt and other countries. This has made billions for Putin in the last year alone. Putin wins if the…

I don't disagree with most of this. My point is only that if the West is not sending Ukraine SOTA across the board, it's not a serious handicap AFAICT.

if the PATRIOT missile systems that were promised were actually delivered ukraine would already be in a better position to defend against the countrywide missile attacks that have been going on. the problem i have with this is that the goal is not to end the conflict as much as it is to maintain the status quo.

Re: Ask HN: Aren't you afraid of a possible world conflict?

#72

Post by mnky9800n »

badpun wrote: post #27
mnky9800n wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't matter what Russia is fighting with. The war is not about winning, it is about war profiteering. Both for Putin and the West. While the West gives out fat new contracts to build new weapons, Putin has stolen much of the grain produced in Ukraine and launders it through ship to ship transfers then sells to Egypt and other countries. This has made billions for Putin in the last year alone. Putin wins if the…

Short term, this war is costing Putin dearly - both inflation and rates in Russia are very high, there's a state of technological collapse (trains derailing etc.) due to sanctions and lack of access to advanced Western technology. Ultimately, he may only benefit if he's allowed to keep the territory he conquered and gets to absorb it into Russia. It may (or may not) be worth the cost he's paying for it right now.

he is currently making billions of dollars selling stolen ukrainian grain on the open market. why should he stop?

Re: Ask HN: Aren't you afraid of a possible world conflict?

#74

Post by 082349872349872 »

arisAlexis wrote: post #30
082349872349872 wrote: post #12

My question: after having survived the Cold War without actually blowing each other up (and wintering everyone else out), why were people so scared of "terrorism" at the turn of the century?

So not blowing ourselves up , up to now means that we will never do ? Strange logic fallacy but I've heard it before.

No, avoiding blowing ourselves up (or summering ourselves out?) means we had much bigger things to be afraid of than capital-t Terrorism.

For what it's worth, I believe that instead of starting a war and an occupation, when the Taliban said they were ready to give ObL up on condition the US provide some evidence he was behind WTC, they could've simply been taken up on their offer. (Similar goes for "WMD")

Re: Ask HN: Aren't you afraid of a possible world conflict?

#75

Post by guiraldelli »

peepeepoopoo91 wrote: post #58
guiraldelli wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I might be mistaken, but as far as I remember, there were NATO troops (that were not US troops) in Afghanistan, for decades, not because any European country declared war to Afghanistan. I am not expert in history, but I cannot recall Europeans using US troops in an active war since creation of NATO. The opposite can be said in this century, though. I do not deny that having the back of US, that has possibly the bigg…

[dead]

In the last ten years, USA more than doubled the imports from EU [1], mostly machinery and vehicles, as well as other manufactured (i.e., industrialised) products such as chemicals.

In average, there is 200 billion USD/year [2]unbalance between imports from and exports to EU.

Now, imagine a war breaking in Europe, and overnight medicine and machinery [3] lacking in USA.

And those are products that need know-how, it is not something that any government can solve soon. Besides the 800 billion USD suddenly removed from the economy.

For better or for worse, we are all interdependent. And no matter how much we want to believe we can simply show a middle finger to our allies when it is convenient for us, the reality is that the interdependence in the real world, not in the demagogic one of political nonsense discourses, is a fact.

[1]: https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php...

[2]: https://www.census.gov/foreign-trade/balance/c0003.html

[3]: https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php...

Re: Ask HN: Aren't you afraid of a possible world conflict?

#76

Post by euroderf »

mnky9800n wrote: post #71
euroderf wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't disagree with most of this. My point is only that if the West is not sending Ukraine SOTA across the board, it's not a serious handicap AFAICT.

if the PATRIOT missile systems that were promised were actually delivered ukraine would already be in a better position to defend against the countrywide missile attacks that have been going on. the problem i have with this is that the goal is not to end the conflict as much as it is to maintain the status quo.

Patriots are ridiculously expensive (a cool billion per battery), and best kept for certain missile threats. There are other cheaper weapons for other missile threats.

But yeah, Western assistance is more of a slow drip than a proper flow.

Re: Ask HN: Aren't you afraid of a possible world conflict?

#77

Post by acdha »

skwee357 wrote: post #16

The thing is, I no longer trust any news source. They all exist to serve their agenda, while rarely providing the real picture. So there is no way for me, as a regular citizen, to truly know what happens in the world or a particular regional conflict. So while I do worry that there might be a bigger war, I also realize that the picture painted by the news, or the "promises" that different country leaders make, are me…

> The thing is, I no longer trust any news source. They all exist to serve their agenda, while rarely providing the real picture. So there is no way for me, as a regular citizen, to truly know what happens in the world or a particular regional conflict.

This is what the authoritarians want. It’s not actually hard to understand the major trends are in the world, with accurate information available, but that’s bad for their interests and so they spread the message you’re repeating now to make people more likely to support them. We saw this dramatically in the United States where the ability to answer basic factual questions correctly inversely correlated with supporting the winning candidate, or earlier support for Brexit, but it’s been a staple of living in countries like Russia or Hungary, and a key part of the fossil fuel industry’s effort not to get stuck with the bill for climate change.

There’s plenty of legitimate criticism of organizations like the NYT or BBC, but if you follow them you’ll have a much more accurate understanding of the world than someone who consumes Murdoch media or, worse, whatever’s floating around social media. There is objective truth in the world, and every study shows a significant gradient here.

Re: Ask HN: Aren't you afraid of a possible world conflict?

#78

Post by jlengrand »

peepeepoopoo89 wrote: post #31
beretguy wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you are ok with if nobody will come to help you when your life is in danger because your life is not anyone else's problem.

NATO as it exists today is a welfare program where US taxpayers subsidize the defense budgets of European countries so they can afford lavish social benefits programs for their citizens while the US drowns in both personal and federal debt. You were never going to come help us, and the exploitative relationship between our countries is now over. Good luck.

In volume, maybe, not in % though. https://i.abcnewsfe.com/a/8b366e9a-5353-4a83-9510-bad111a54d...

Which should still leave plenty for lavish social benefits programs, since other places can afford it.

Genuinely looking forward seeing the US folks get a better coverage soon.

Re: Ask HN: Aren't you afraid of a possible world conflict?

#79

Post by Yawrehto »

ipnon wrote: post #24

Military victory has been a precondition to military punishment for all of human history. You had to disable the enemy’s forces before you used the threat of further violence to enact your political will. In fact for all of recorded warfare, it was expected that the victors would be able to commit what we today call war crimes with impunity. The default consequence of defeat was all of your men being killed, all of y…

I always have trouble with claims that our time is unique,because I can quickly construct arguments for just about any other time. So yes, our era is unique, but is it uniquely unique?
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