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Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?

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Re: Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?

#71

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Dude, what? How many services require SMS 2FA again?

Your phone is indeed a SPOF. If you lose your phone, you're fucked in a variety of scenarios. To say nothing of services that require a custom app and accept nothing else.

Re: Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?

#73

This has been my point for the last 5 or 10 years. That's why I have a "home phone" with banking apps, 2FA and important stuff installed. It has no SIM card and never leaves home. For everything else I have my "street phone".

Yes, but then again, I'm looking at seven older smartphones —right now— on my desk, and only one is even capable of running /all/ those apps.

I had to buy it just because of that. 'cause even my Huawei P-Smart 2021 (currently in my pocket and not among the others on my desk) can't run some of those pesky apps.

Re: Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?

#74

This has been my point for the last 5 or 10 years. That's why I have a "home phone" with banking apps, 2FA and important stuff installed. It has no SIM card and never leaves home. For everything else I have my "street phone".

Many banking apps require a phone number/SIM card to operate, but assuming you can copy codes, etc, what happens when you want to use those apps out and about (or abroad) if the phone never leaves home?

This too... :(

Re: Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?

#75
Not true at all. If they are able to log into your e-mail, then things will start to fall apart. But just getting your phone will not allow anyone to break into your MFA secured accounts. Your phone is something you own, but they still need something you know (i.e. your password). I feel like you might get a more nuanced perspective by looking into security related topics, specifically around authentication.

Re: Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?

#77
post #18

This is a big problem for me as a traveller. If I travel long distance and I lose my phone, I lose access to both my personal and business bank. I once dropped my phone in a lake (I'm clumsy) and was locked out of most things for a few weeks. I prefer TOTP for most things. Keepass supports them across platforms, but Aegis has a better experience on mobiles.

The eSim's are available these days so you don't have to wait for new SIM to arrive... if your provider & phone supports this feature.

Don't eSIMs have an even worse failure mode? If the phone itself dies then there's no SIM for you to take out and put into a new phone immediately right? As I understand it you have to first find another phone (with a working line!) to call your provider with, hope that it's within their business hours, and wait on hold for who knows how long, until you finally get it set up? Because of course you don't have anything urgent you need to take care of in the meantime while you wait for your carrier to give you back the keys to your digital life right?

Re: Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?

#79
post #48

I don't have the same view, in my mind you have created a single point of failure for _yourself_. I use Authy for MFA, which comes with a desktop app. Phones dead / missing? No problem, I can get OTP's from my laptop. What about text messages? Google voice. Which of course has a desktop interface. I've been doing this for years. It's nice not to have to rely on a watch, or phone entirely - although they do make my li…

The issue is that some services insist on using their own app as a second factor. You can't choose to use a superior U2F YubiKey, for example. You are also not allowed to have their shitty app installed on multiple phones at the same time. If you lose your phone, you need to call them up to reset this. To name and shame: BNP Paribas, one of the biggest banks in France.

> you need to call them up to reset this

My bank sent me a super key (some colorful QR code) to setup new 2FA devices, which I need to securely store somewhere.

Re: Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?

#80

Not true at all. If they are able to log into your e-mail, then things will start to fall apart. But just getting your phone will not allow anyone to break into your MFA secured accounts. Your phone is something you own, but they still need something you know (i.e. your password). I feel like you might get a more nuanced perspective by looking into security related topics, specifically around authentication.

The "nuanced perspective" here is that regular people don't use MFA authenticator apps. They use SMS 2FA, if anything. Once you accept that, you're right back to "smartphones as a SPOF."
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