671–680 of 974 posts
We already earn well above average, don't have to pay healthcare and bay area rent.
I don't see many experienced devs/engineers complaining that they're not paid double like americans, because we already earn enough to keep us in a decently above average lifestyle.
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> You can't have low inequality by definition if you decide to start paying one group a ton of money. You can, if you give the other groups a ton of money too. Wages in Europe have stagnated compared to GDP [1] too, so it's not unreasonable to fight for higher wages. [1]: https://www.robert-schuman.eu/en/european-issues/0289-labour...
There is only so much "richness" you can share. You can't give 400 million american a nice car, a big house with a view on the ocean, 100% organic food and access to top level healthcare and education. Unless you produce those thing at that scale, and some things are by definition not scalable (there is only one "best medical school in the US"). So some people have more power to get access to/acquire those desirable…
When everybody have those things, you no longer think of them as "richness". Richness is what sticks out.
150 years ago very few people had running water, electricity, fridge, WC, etc.
Most urban americans live "richer" lives today than the rich did 150 years ago.
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Agree with this take, being in the upper 10% of salaries in Sweden gave me perspective on how wide of a gap there is between myself, some friends working other office jobs (accountants, architects) and some in more blue collar work. I don't feel like I deserve a much higher salary than what I have for this society, I'll be honest and say that sometimes I feel ashamed of earning so much more than some friends given th…
Being from the Netherlands, I recognize this shame. High positions in the workforce are often shamed, talked about as "easy money", as if it's inherently corrupt, people don't acknowledge their risks and responsibilities. Whether that warrants those high salaries or not, I'm not commenting on that debate. Public functions or private organizations in which the government invests, must cap salaries at what the prime mi…
The idea of talking about money is slightly awkward anyway, and I guess I'd say embarrassed rather than ashamed? Different culture and motivation, but a datapoint for you :)
I got my higher education for free. I expect to save nothing for my children or their education. I expect to have to put aside very little for retirement. The thing is, I just can’t find an argument why I should be able to get very rich doing my job. It’s a comfortable job. It pays a good salary. I got here by taking no risk at all. I wouldn’t want to switch jobs just to drive up my pay even if I could. I have other…
> I got here by taking no risk at all. This is the most European thing I've ever heard. Most people would not like to take risks and would not even think about stepping outside of their comfort zone. Personally, I think this is the reason why there are less startups in Europe compared to US. No one would like to take a risk unless it's absolutely necessary. > I have worked 20 years in the same job and so have my coll…
If you have a good job with a stimulating environment, colleagues, and decent pay, then the perception of being stuck does not exist. Over time the role will change to reflect the changing organisation and role.
I got my higher education for free. I expect to save nothing for my children or their education. I expect to have to put aside very little for retirement. The thing is, I just can’t find an argument why I should be able to get very rich doing my job. It’s a comfortable job. It pays a good salary. I got here by taking no risk at all. I wouldn’t want to switch jobs just to drive up my pay even if I could. I have other…
That everyone should aim to be super stinking rich, or everyone is living in the gutter, but there's no inbetween
Unis are telling people that they can be the next zuckerberg or bezos, instead of telling them that they can earn well enough to have a very comfortable lifestyle for the rest of their lives
Ha, good one! If I wasn't living in Europe probably even three concurrent full-time FAANG-like SWE jobs for the last 10 years wouldn't cover the medical expenses I have accumulated by now. Makes sense people earn more money over there. And don't even get me started on my education ...
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Except I wasn't talking about Ireland which has low taxes and high wages for sw devs compared to continental Europe.
Ireland does not have low taxes for individuals compared to continental Europe. Even compared to Sweden, personal taxation is comparable for high-earners, although Ireland's much more progressive and redistributive scheme results in lower taxes for low-earners, and thus a smaller tax base.
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Soooo... You think this is how things should be?
My point is that if I in the USA can have similar benefits as developers in Europe (based on OP's comment) then they should be able to be paid the same as developers in the USA. OP seemed to be saying that because of all the benefits it was okay they were paid so poorly. But we can have similar benefits here, so they can have similar pay there.
You realize in Germany these "benefits" are available to literally every citizen, right? That means _every developer got this deal, here.
So here is the thing: You can get obscenely rich here, too.
What's your point, really? That you can get rich in America, as a dev? That rich people get all the benefits? Your take on parenting?
Really insightful information there. Thanks for sharing....
Start contracting remotely for US based companies. For them, you’re cheap(-er) labor, for yourself, you’ll make more than what you used to make in Europe.
Not cheap if USD keeps falling compared to EUR. My income dropped about 12% since the last peak. Not that I'm complaining, but given the current USD circulation I'm thinking it might lose 50% of value in the next years.
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No, in the UK, your marginal rate at that income would be 42% (40% income + 2% National Insurance).
+9% if you’re still repaying student loans, which is common until 40s. Student loans operate like a tax in the U.K., taking 9% of your pre-tax income above 15 or 25k directly from your payslip.