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Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

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Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#61

Post by mixmastamyk »

tuyguntn wrote: post #3

Yes, when 50 years old applies as a senior engineer, 25 years old senior engineers get uncomfortable. You might not notice it in any public conversation, but there is still a resistance: * will they be on-call? * can they work long hours? * how do I delegate to them? * are they going to resist new tech?

As the fifties version of myself, I won’t need to be on-call or work long hours because I did it right the first time.

Reply to below:

Of course. But if you plan ahead properly, it will be extremely rare. To the point where it isn’t economical to have people on call. Because the downtime was caused by a meteor or maybe AWS.

If it is truly mission critical, have a night shift.

Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#62

Post by leonagano »

aipatselarom wrote: post #21

>I launched a job board [...] Weird, it says there your wife did.

At the time I was an employee. They didn't like people launching side-projects, so, I involved my wife in the process. She's PR, so, she sent it to the media.

I did the rest, being developing, contacting companies and talking to over 40s.

Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#63

Post by drillsteps5 »

vergessenmir wrote: post #10

get work done, look younger and slice off the first 5 years of your experience because it is "not relevant". I look about 10-12 years younger so I am able to slip under the radar but it makes me wonder how my peers who look visibly their age fare? The job market is london, sector: Hedge funds, asset mangement tech etc.

Your application and resume will go through multiple systems and viewed and assessed by 3 to 5 people before anybody can even see your (presumably younger) face.

In the resume, you can remove your experience prior to certain date (which is recommended anyways as it makes your resume shorter and very few employers care what you did 15 years ago), but you do have to list your education and most ATS systems require graduation dates.

Even if you do manage to omit the dates, if you were senior developer or architect in the very the first position from 12 years ago that you have on your resume, the recruiter/hiring manager will be able to put 2 and 2 together.

All the advice I've heard from the career/job search/whatever coaches/advisors was to not try to hide your age but use it your advantage. Trying to hide your age doesn't just make you looking silly, it might create an impression that you're hiding something more serious.

But yeah, looking younger and healthier definitely doesn't hurt, not just in job search but in life in general.

Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#64

Post by dragonwriter »

chucksmash wrote: post #60
deadbabe wrote: post #34

There is all kinds of ‘isms in tech. Pretty much the only people who don’t have to worry are young straight white males. I suspect before ageism disappears it will first swing the other way where older tech workers snub young people entering the industry writing them off as vibecoders who don’t know anything and are easily replaced with an AI.

You just did an ism...

Observing the aggregate effect of discrimination is not discrimination.

Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#65

Post by inetknght »

awb wrote: post #59

IMO, it depends. I’ve worked with hundreds of startups over the last 20 years. The most significant trend I’ve seen is cultural cohesion. Some startups have a young, energetic culture. Some have an experienced, veteran culture. Some have a quirky, trendy culture. But overall many companies seem to value and attract more of the same culture they already have in place. So to a degree, I’d say yes ageism exists in certa…

> I’ve worked with hundreds of startups over the last 20 years.

That's averaging 5 startups every year. How can you get good experience, or even truly understand a business, if you're averaging just around two months at a company or multiple companies in the same period?

Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#66

Post by iknowSFR »

jimt1234 wrote: post #35

I used to work with a guy that was known for dressing nice, very formal. Back in the 2000s, he would wear button-down shirts, slacks, nice shoes; he stood out for a software nerd. Anyway, when I saw him recently, he was dressed in jeans and flip-flops, wearing a t-shirt. I asked him what's with the casual attire. He just said, "Trying to keep my job." Being an older dude in this field as well, I know what he's talkin…

Wasn’t the same true of his original attire selection, though? If he wore jeans in the 2000s, he would have faced consequences. So he wore slacks. What’s really changed?

Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#67

Post by mixmastamyk »

ldjkfkdsjnv wrote: post #57
mixmastamyk wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Feels a bit cynical. Raising questions is incredibly valuable for a company as long as it is done in a positive manner. It’s what they tell us is the main benefit to DEI, and you can tell whether they are serious if they include older folks in their program or not.

its valuable for the company, not for the line managers/product managers

A successful business accrues to everyone, as long as you’re not obsessed with taking absolute credit. I’ve only worked with one or two such dysfunctional folks in my entire career.

Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#68

Post by jghn »

jasonthorsness wrote: post #14

I observed engineers at all ages at many levels and roles (manager vs. IC) at Microsoft. To the point of us having retirement parties. I am sure ageism is real but part of the meme of "no software engineers over 40" is just the population curve of developers making them less common. And probably there's something broken with the recruiting pipelines.

Yes. People don't take into account the growth in the number of developers over time. When the ageism discussion started, there was a huge growth in the developer market, which meant that a disproportionate number of devs were on the younger side of the spectrum. Now that we're a few decades into the conversation, that initial glut of devs are the greybeards. Thus it appears that there's more old people rolling around.

Is there ageism? I'm sure. As an old, I'm going to avoid companies that give off a younger, coder bro type vibe. Partially because I assume they're more likely to be ageist. But mostly because even if they *didn't* have an ageist viewpoint and hired me, I know it's just not where I personally want to be.

Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#70

Post by saulpw »

iknowSFR wrote: post #66
jimt1234 wrote: post #35

I used to work with a guy that was known for dressing nice, very formal. Back in the 2000s, he would wear button-down shirts, slacks, nice shoes; he stood out for a software nerd. Anyway, when I saw him recently, he was dressed in jeans and flip-flops, wearing a t-shirt. I asked him what's with the casual attire. He just said, "Trying to keep my job." Being an older dude in this field as well, I know what he's talkin…

Wasn’t the same true of his original attire selection, though? If he wore jeans in the 2000s, he would have faced consequences. So he wore slacks. What’s really changed?

As the parent comment said, he stood out for dressing nicely those years ago. Wearing jeans in the 2000s was not just tolerated or accepted, it was expected. I remember feeling wary of engineers who dressed up for interviews then, like they were trying too hard.
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